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Teferi's Time Twist on creature with +1/+1 counter
What happens when a creature with Persist AND Undying dies? ('return to battlefield' issues…)Why did Experiment One not get a counter when my Undying creature returned to play?Instantaneous creature death and checking conditionsWhat's the use of blinking a creature out (such as with Essence Flux)?If Dragonlord Silumgar dies during combat, when does the creature he stole change control?How often can I activate planeswalker abilities with Teferi's emblem?Interaction between Time of Ice and RescueIf I flash in Teferi, Time Raveler, can its passive ability counter a spell on the stack?Captive Audience vs. Teferi's Time TwistTeferi's Time Twist and Gideon's Sacrifice
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If I control a River Sneak with a +1/+1 counter on it and then play Teferi's Time Twist targeting my River Sneak would the river sneak return as a 4/4 or a 3/3?
magic-the-gathering
asked Jul 14 at 21:41
JokusJokus
857 bronze badges
add a comment |
If I control a River Sneak with a +1/+1 counter on it and then play Teferi's Time Twist targeting my River Sneak would the river sneak return as a 4/4 or a 3/3?
magic-the-gathering
asked Jul 14 at 21:41
JokusJokus
857 bronze badges
Note that River Sneak says another Merfolk creature. It is not triggered by itself.
– infinitezero
Jul 16 at 8:49
add a comment |
If I control a River Sneak with a +1/+1 counter on it and then play Teferi's Time Twist targeting my River Sneak would the river sneak return as a 4/4 or a 3/3?
magic-the-gathering
asked Jul 14 at 21:41
JokusJokus
857 bronze badges
If I control a River Sneak with a +1/+1 counter on it and then play Teferi's Time Twist targeting my River Sneak would the river sneak return as a 4/4 or a 3/3?
magic-the-gathering
magic-the-gathering
asked Jul 14 at 21:41
JokusJokus
857 bronze badges
asked Jul 14 at 21:41
JokusJokus
857 bronze badges
asked Jul 14 at 21:41
JokusJokus
857 bronze badges
asked Jul 14 at 21:41
JokusJokus
857 bronze badges
asked Jul 14 at 21:41
JokusJokus
857 bronze badges
857 bronze badges
Note that River Sneak says another Merfolk creature. It is not triggered by itself.
– infinitezero
Jul 16 at 8:49
add a comment |
Note that River Sneak says another Merfolk creature. It is not triggered by itself.
– infinitezero
Jul 16 at 8:49
Note that River Sneak says another Merfolk creature. It is not triggered by itself.
– infinitezero
Jul 16 at 8:49
Note that River Sneak says another Merfolk creature. It is not triggered by itself.
– infinitezero
Jul 16 at 8:49
add a comment |
1 Answer
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The River Sneak enters the battlefield as a 2/2 because it will have only a single +1/+1 counter on top of its base 1/1 stats. Rule 122.2 says
Counters on an object are not retained if that object moves from one zone to another. The counters are not “removed”; they simply cease to exist. See rule 400.7.
Teferi's Time Twist moves the permanent into exile, then back onto the battlefield. As it moves into exile, the counter(s) it originally had on the battlefield disappear. Teferi's Time Twist specifically puts a +1/+1 counter on the creature, so it enters with that single counter, for total stats of 2/2.
Teferi's Time Twist says that the creature enters the battlefield "with an additional +1/+1 counter on it". This counter is in addition to any other counters the creature would enter with for other reasons. Barkhide Troll, for example, will enter with a +1/+1 counter because of its own ability, plus an additional counter because of the effect from Teferi's Time Twist.
answered Jul 14 at 21:59
murgatroid99♦murgatroid99
50.7k8 gold badges131 silver badges215 bronze badges
5
I believe the word “additional” in Teferi’s Time Twist is the source of confusion. It might be useful to address that directly, and explain what situations that word is relevant for, e.g. when a creature itself also has “~ enters the battlefield with # +1/+1 counter(s).” (+1 either way, I just think it would make the answer a bit better.)
– KRyan
Jul 15 at 14:23
1
I've added an explanation of that bit.
– murgatroid99♦
Jul 15 at 21:10
add a comment |
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The River Sneak enters the battlefield as a 2/2 because it will have only a single +1/+1 counter on top of its base 1/1 stats. Rule 122.2 says
Counters on an object are not retained if that object moves from one zone to another. The counters are not “removed”; they simply cease to exist. See rule 400.7.
Teferi's Time Twist moves the permanent into exile, then back onto the battlefield. As it moves into exile, the counter(s) it originally had on the battlefield disappear. Teferi's Time Twist specifically puts a +1/+1 counter on the creature, so it enters with that single counter, for total stats of 2/2.
Teferi's Time Twist says that the creature enters the battlefield "with an additional +1/+1 counter on it". This counter is in addition to any other counters the creature would enter with for other reasons. Barkhide Troll, for example, will enter with a +1/+1 counter because of its own ability, plus an additional counter because of the effect from Teferi's Time Twist.
answered Jul 14 at 21:59
murgatroid99♦murgatroid99
50.7k8 gold badges131 silver badges215 bronze badges
5
I believe the word “additional” in Teferi’s Time Twist is the source of confusion. It might be useful to address that directly, and explain what situations that word is relevant for, e.g. when a creature itself also has “~ enters the battlefield with # +1/+1 counter(s).” (+1 either way, I just think it would make the answer a bit better.)
– KRyan
Jul 15 at 14:23
1
I've added an explanation of that bit.
– murgatroid99♦
Jul 15 at 21:10
add a comment |
The River Sneak enters the battlefield as a 2/2 because it will have only a single +1/+1 counter on top of its base 1/1 stats. Rule 122.2 says
Counters on an object are not retained if that object moves from one zone to another. The counters are not “removed”; they simply cease to exist. See rule 400.7.
Teferi's Time Twist moves the permanent into exile, then back onto the battlefield. As it moves into exile, the counter(s) it originally had on the battlefield disappear. Teferi's Time Twist specifically puts a +1/+1 counter on the creature, so it enters with that single counter, for total stats of 2/2.
Teferi's Time Twist says that the creature enters the battlefield "with an additional +1/+1 counter on it". This counter is in addition to any other counters the creature would enter with for other reasons. Barkhide Troll, for example, will enter with a +1/+1 counter because of its own ability, plus an additional counter because of the effect from Teferi's Time Twist.
answered Jul 14 at 21:59
murgatroid99♦murgatroid99
50.7k8 gold badges131 silver badges215 bronze badges
5
I believe the word “additional” in Teferi’s Time Twist is the source of confusion. It might be useful to address that directly, and explain what situations that word is relevant for, e.g. when a creature itself also has “~ enters the battlefield with # +1/+1 counter(s).” (+1 either way, I just think it would make the answer a bit better.)
– KRyan
Jul 15 at 14:23
1
I've added an explanation of that bit.
– murgatroid99♦
Jul 15 at 21:10
add a comment |
The River Sneak enters the battlefield as a 2/2 because it will have only a single +1/+1 counter on top of its base 1/1 stats. Rule 122.2 says
Counters on an object are not retained if that object moves from one zone to another. The counters are not “removed”; they simply cease to exist. See rule 400.7.
Teferi's Time Twist moves the permanent into exile, then back onto the battlefield. As it moves into exile, the counter(s) it originally had on the battlefield disappear. Teferi's Time Twist specifically puts a +1/+1 counter on the creature, so it enters with that single counter, for total stats of 2/2.
Teferi's Time Twist says that the creature enters the battlefield "with an additional +1/+1 counter on it". This counter is in addition to any other counters the creature would enter with for other reasons. Barkhide Troll, for example, will enter with a +1/+1 counter because of its own ability, plus an additional counter because of the effect from Teferi's Time Twist.
answered Jul 14 at 21:59
murgatroid99♦murgatroid99
50.7k8 gold badges131 silver badges215 bronze badges
The River Sneak enters the battlefield as a 2/2 because it will have only a single +1/+1 counter on top of its base 1/1 stats. Rule 122.2 says
Counters on an object are not retained if that object moves from one zone to another. The counters are not “removed”; they simply cease to exist. See rule 400.7.
Teferi's Time Twist moves the permanent into exile, then back onto the battlefield. As it moves into exile, the counter(s) it originally had on the battlefield disappear. Teferi's Time Twist specifically puts a +1/+1 counter on the creature, so it enters with that single counter, for total stats of 2/2.
Teferi's Time Twist says that the creature enters the battlefield "with an additional +1/+1 counter on it". This counter is in addition to any other counters the creature would enter with for other reasons. Barkhide Troll, for example, will enter with a +1/+1 counter because of its own ability, plus an additional counter because of the effect from Teferi's Time Twist.
answered Jul 14 at 21:59
murgatroid99♦murgatroid99
50.7k8 gold badges131 silver badges215 bronze badges
edited Jul 15 at 21:10
answered Jul 14 at 21:59
murgatroid99♦murgatroid99
50.7k8 gold badges131 silver badges215 bronze badges
answered Jul 14 at 21:59
murgatroid99♦murgatroid99
50.7k8 gold badges131 silver badges215 bronze badges
answered Jul 14 at 21:59
murgatroid99♦murgatroid99
50.7k8 gold badges131 silver badges215 bronze badges
50.7k8 gold badges131 silver badges215 bronze badges
5
I believe the word “additional” in Teferi’s Time Twist is the source of confusion. It might be useful to address that directly, and explain what situations that word is relevant for, e.g. when a creature itself also has “~ enters the battlefield with # +1/+1 counter(s).” (+1 either way, I just think it would make the answer a bit better.)
– KRyan
Jul 15 at 14:23
1
I've added an explanation of that bit.
– murgatroid99♦
Jul 15 at 21:10
add a comment |
5
I believe the word “additional” in Teferi’s Time Twist is the source of confusion. It might be useful to address that directly, and explain what situations that word is relevant for, e.g. when a creature itself also has “~ enters the battlefield with # +1/+1 counter(s).” (+1 either way, I just think it would make the answer a bit better.)
– KRyan
Jul 15 at 14:23
1
I've added an explanation of that bit.
– murgatroid99♦
Jul 15 at 21:10
5
5
I believe the word “additional” in Teferi’s Time Twist is the source of confusion. It might be useful to address that directly, and explain what situations that word is relevant for, e.g. when a creature itself also has “~ enters the battlefield with # +1/+1 counter(s).” (+1 either way, I just think it would make the answer a bit better.)
– KRyan
Jul 15 at 14:23
I believe the word “additional” in Teferi’s Time Twist is the source of confusion. It might be useful to address that directly, and explain what situations that word is relevant for, e.g. when a creature itself also has “~ enters the battlefield with # +1/+1 counter(s).” (+1 either way, I just think it would make the answer a bit better.)
– KRyan
Jul 15 at 14:23
1
1
I've added an explanation of that bit.
– murgatroid99♦
Jul 15 at 21:10
I've added an explanation of that bit.
– murgatroid99♦
Jul 15 at 21:10
add a comment |
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Note that River Sneak says another Merfolk creature. It is not triggered by itself.
– infinitezero
Jul 16 at 8:49