Do you need a weapon for Thunderous Smite, and the other 'Smite' spells?Is an Unarmed Strike considered a Weapon attack?Paladin Smite Spells and the Steed: Can either or both trigger the damage?Can I sneak attack with Green-Flame Blade or Booming Blade?Is my monk/wizard multiclass house rule overpowered?Can I use the Booming Blade/Green-Flame Blade cantrips from hiding and still have advantage (for Sneak Attacks)?Are Improvised Weapons used in melee actually melee weapons?Can you benefit from Horde Breaker if you attack as part of Booming Blade or Green Flame Blade?Does Wand of the War Mage bonus apply to spells like GFB and Booming Blade?Does a missed Green-Flame Blade trigger Flames of Phlegethos wreath?Booming Blade or Green Flame Blade: Utility against creatures with immunity to non-magical damage?Does Improved Divine Smite trigger when a paladin makes an unarmed strike?

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Do you need a weapon for Thunderous Smite, and the other 'Smite' spells?


Is an Unarmed Strike considered a Weapon attack?Paladin Smite Spells and the Steed: Can either or both trigger the damage?Can I sneak attack with Green-Flame Blade or Booming Blade?Is my monk/wizard multiclass house rule overpowered?Can I use the Booming Blade/Green-Flame Blade cantrips from hiding and still have advantage (for Sneak Attacks)?Are Improvised Weapons used in melee actually melee weapons?Can you benefit from Horde Breaker if you attack as part of Booming Blade or Green Flame Blade?Does Wand of the War Mage bonus apply to spells like GFB and Booming Blade?Does a missed Green-Flame Blade trigger Flames of Phlegethos wreath?Booming Blade or Green Flame Blade: Utility against creatures with immunity to non-magical damage?Does Improved Divine Smite trigger when a paladin makes an unarmed strike?






.everyoneloves__top-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__mid-leaderboard:empty,.everyoneloves__bot-mid-leaderboard:empty margin-bottom:0;








9












$begingroup$


Since unarmed strikes are considered melee weapon attacks, and the 'smite' spells don't have the same restriction as booming blade or green flame blade (the part where it requires "a weapon" in material components)



Would you be able to cast and trigger the 'smite' spells (like thunderous smite, searing smite, etc.) with unarmed strikes as they are melee weapon attacks?










share|improve this question











$endgroup$







  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Related on Is an unarmed strike considered a weapon attack?
    $endgroup$
    – NautArch
    Apr 24 at 13:59

















9












$begingroup$


Since unarmed strikes are considered melee weapon attacks, and the 'smite' spells don't have the same restriction as booming blade or green flame blade (the part where it requires "a weapon" in material components)



Would you be able to cast and trigger the 'smite' spells (like thunderous smite, searing smite, etc.) with unarmed strikes as they are melee weapon attacks?










share|improve this question











$endgroup$







  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Related on Is an unarmed strike considered a weapon attack?
    $endgroup$
    – NautArch
    Apr 24 at 13:59













9












9








9





$begingroup$


Since unarmed strikes are considered melee weapon attacks, and the 'smite' spells don't have the same restriction as booming blade or green flame blade (the part where it requires "a weapon" in material components)



Would you be able to cast and trigger the 'smite' spells (like thunderous smite, searing smite, etc.) with unarmed strikes as they are melee weapon attacks?










share|improve this question











$endgroup$




Since unarmed strikes are considered melee weapon attacks, and the 'smite' spells don't have the same restriction as booming blade or green flame blade (the part where it requires "a weapon" in material components)



Would you be able to cast and trigger the 'smite' spells (like thunderous smite, searing smite, etc.) with unarmed strikes as they are melee weapon attacks?







dnd-5e spells paladin unarmed-combat






share|improve this question















share|improve this question













share|improve this question




share|improve this question








edited Apr 24 at 14:34









Someone_Evil

3,7691035




3,7691035










asked Apr 24 at 13:54









guessguess

501111




501111







  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Related on Is an unarmed strike considered a weapon attack?
    $endgroup$
    – NautArch
    Apr 24 at 13:59












  • 1




    $begingroup$
    Related on Is an unarmed strike considered a weapon attack?
    $endgroup$
    – NautArch
    Apr 24 at 13:59







1




1




$begingroup$
Related on Is an unarmed strike considered a weapon attack?
$endgroup$
– NautArch
Apr 24 at 13:59




$begingroup$
Related on Is an unarmed strike considered a weapon attack?
$endgroup$
– NautArch
Apr 24 at 13:59










2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes


















16












$begingroup$

You need a weapon for all the smite spells (except wrathful smite)



Smite spells require a weapon



Thunderous smite says:




The first time you hit with a melee weapon attack during the spell's duration, your weapon rings with thunder ...




In fact, every smite spell has similar language specifically calling out the need for a weapon (except for wrathful smite see below). By a strict RAW reading though the weapon does not actually need to be the one that makes the attack, but you still need a weapon.



Regardless, I think it is pretty clear here that the spell is intended to utilize the weapon that you use to make the melee weapon attack even if the wording leaves a bit of a loophole. Either way, the spells do require a weapon.



The body/unarmed strikes are not weapons



The PHB says:




Instead of using a weapon to make a melee weapon attack, you can use an unarmed strike: a punch, kick, head-butt, or similar forceful blow (none of which count as weapons). (PHB 195)




Suggesting that though body parts are not weapons, the unarmed strike still counts as a melee weapon attack but explicitly not a weapon.



And the Sage Advice Compendium clarifies this and makes it explicit:




[A]n unarmed strike counts as a melee weapon attack, even though the attacker’s body isn’t considered a weapon.




Since the smite spells specifically call out a weapon in their description, that is what they require. And since unarmed strikes are not considered to be weapons, then they do not qualify.




Wrathful smite does not need a weapon



Wrathful smite is, for some reason, the only smite spell that does not specifically call out the need for a weapon.1




The first time you hit with a melee weapon attack during the spell's duration, your attack deals an extra 1d6 psychic damage.




Thus, since the unarmed strikes do count as melee weapon attacks, a character would be able to use an unarmed strike to cause the effect, no weapon required at all.




1 - Thanks @Someone_Evil for catching this.






share|improve this answer











$endgroup$




















    1












    $begingroup$

    I agree with Rubiksmoose's answer that the smite spells (except wrathful smite) require a weapon.



    However, I thought it might be useful to share my own house ruling on the subject. I decreed that, while the resident paladin couldn't use a smite barehanded, a gauntlet could count as a weapon for the purposes of the various smite spells.



    Note that, to the best of my knowledge, gauntlets arent considered weapons anywhere in the RAW. They do, however, provide a way to "disarm" a paladin so that they can't just punch holes through monsters with impunity. I felt it wouldn't break the game too much to tweak the rules in such a fashion, and I honestly wanted to see where she was going with it.



    The paladin eventually took advantage of this ruling to literally backhand a wereboar to death. It was a very cool moment in-game, and I regret nothing. As always, Your Mileage May Vary.






    share|improve this answer











    $endgroup$












    • $begingroup$
      You should summarize the accepted answer's conclusion (instead of just saying you agree with it), so that your answer can stand on its own. I've done it for you this time :)
      $endgroup$
      – V2Blast
      Apr 24 at 22:01











    • $begingroup$
      @V2Blast Kindly appreciated.
      $endgroup$
      – TheVagrantDog
      2 days ago











    Your Answer








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    2 Answers
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    2 Answers
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    active

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    active

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    16












    $begingroup$

    You need a weapon for all the smite spells (except wrathful smite)



    Smite spells require a weapon



    Thunderous smite says:




    The first time you hit with a melee weapon attack during the spell's duration, your weapon rings with thunder ...




    In fact, every smite spell has similar language specifically calling out the need for a weapon (except for wrathful smite see below). By a strict RAW reading though the weapon does not actually need to be the one that makes the attack, but you still need a weapon.



    Regardless, I think it is pretty clear here that the spell is intended to utilize the weapon that you use to make the melee weapon attack even if the wording leaves a bit of a loophole. Either way, the spells do require a weapon.



    The body/unarmed strikes are not weapons



    The PHB says:




    Instead of using a weapon to make a melee weapon attack, you can use an unarmed strike: a punch, kick, head-butt, or similar forceful blow (none of which count as weapons). (PHB 195)




    Suggesting that though body parts are not weapons, the unarmed strike still counts as a melee weapon attack but explicitly not a weapon.



    And the Sage Advice Compendium clarifies this and makes it explicit:




    [A]n unarmed strike counts as a melee weapon attack, even though the attacker’s body isn’t considered a weapon.




    Since the smite spells specifically call out a weapon in their description, that is what they require. And since unarmed strikes are not considered to be weapons, then they do not qualify.




    Wrathful smite does not need a weapon



    Wrathful smite is, for some reason, the only smite spell that does not specifically call out the need for a weapon.1




    The first time you hit with a melee weapon attack during the spell's duration, your attack deals an extra 1d6 psychic damage.




    Thus, since the unarmed strikes do count as melee weapon attacks, a character would be able to use an unarmed strike to cause the effect, no weapon required at all.




    1 - Thanks @Someone_Evil for catching this.






    share|improve this answer











    $endgroup$

















      16












      $begingroup$

      You need a weapon for all the smite spells (except wrathful smite)



      Smite spells require a weapon



      Thunderous smite says:




      The first time you hit with a melee weapon attack during the spell's duration, your weapon rings with thunder ...




      In fact, every smite spell has similar language specifically calling out the need for a weapon (except for wrathful smite see below). By a strict RAW reading though the weapon does not actually need to be the one that makes the attack, but you still need a weapon.



      Regardless, I think it is pretty clear here that the spell is intended to utilize the weapon that you use to make the melee weapon attack even if the wording leaves a bit of a loophole. Either way, the spells do require a weapon.



      The body/unarmed strikes are not weapons



      The PHB says:




      Instead of using a weapon to make a melee weapon attack, you can use an unarmed strike: a punch, kick, head-butt, or similar forceful blow (none of which count as weapons). (PHB 195)




      Suggesting that though body parts are not weapons, the unarmed strike still counts as a melee weapon attack but explicitly not a weapon.



      And the Sage Advice Compendium clarifies this and makes it explicit:




      [A]n unarmed strike counts as a melee weapon attack, even though the attacker’s body isn’t considered a weapon.




      Since the smite spells specifically call out a weapon in their description, that is what they require. And since unarmed strikes are not considered to be weapons, then they do not qualify.




      Wrathful smite does not need a weapon



      Wrathful smite is, for some reason, the only smite spell that does not specifically call out the need for a weapon.1




      The first time you hit with a melee weapon attack during the spell's duration, your attack deals an extra 1d6 psychic damage.




      Thus, since the unarmed strikes do count as melee weapon attacks, a character would be able to use an unarmed strike to cause the effect, no weapon required at all.




      1 - Thanks @Someone_Evil for catching this.






      share|improve this answer











      $endgroup$















        16












        16








        16





        $begingroup$

        You need a weapon for all the smite spells (except wrathful smite)



        Smite spells require a weapon



        Thunderous smite says:




        The first time you hit with a melee weapon attack during the spell's duration, your weapon rings with thunder ...




        In fact, every smite spell has similar language specifically calling out the need for a weapon (except for wrathful smite see below). By a strict RAW reading though the weapon does not actually need to be the one that makes the attack, but you still need a weapon.



        Regardless, I think it is pretty clear here that the spell is intended to utilize the weapon that you use to make the melee weapon attack even if the wording leaves a bit of a loophole. Either way, the spells do require a weapon.



        The body/unarmed strikes are not weapons



        The PHB says:




        Instead of using a weapon to make a melee weapon attack, you can use an unarmed strike: a punch, kick, head-butt, or similar forceful blow (none of which count as weapons). (PHB 195)




        Suggesting that though body parts are not weapons, the unarmed strike still counts as a melee weapon attack but explicitly not a weapon.



        And the Sage Advice Compendium clarifies this and makes it explicit:




        [A]n unarmed strike counts as a melee weapon attack, even though the attacker’s body isn’t considered a weapon.




        Since the smite spells specifically call out a weapon in their description, that is what they require. And since unarmed strikes are not considered to be weapons, then they do not qualify.




        Wrathful smite does not need a weapon



        Wrathful smite is, for some reason, the only smite spell that does not specifically call out the need for a weapon.1




        The first time you hit with a melee weapon attack during the spell's duration, your attack deals an extra 1d6 psychic damage.




        Thus, since the unarmed strikes do count as melee weapon attacks, a character would be able to use an unarmed strike to cause the effect, no weapon required at all.




        1 - Thanks @Someone_Evil for catching this.






        share|improve this answer











        $endgroup$



        You need a weapon for all the smite spells (except wrathful smite)



        Smite spells require a weapon



        Thunderous smite says:




        The first time you hit with a melee weapon attack during the spell's duration, your weapon rings with thunder ...




        In fact, every smite spell has similar language specifically calling out the need for a weapon (except for wrathful smite see below). By a strict RAW reading though the weapon does not actually need to be the one that makes the attack, but you still need a weapon.



        Regardless, I think it is pretty clear here that the spell is intended to utilize the weapon that you use to make the melee weapon attack even if the wording leaves a bit of a loophole. Either way, the spells do require a weapon.



        The body/unarmed strikes are not weapons



        The PHB says:




        Instead of using a weapon to make a melee weapon attack, you can use an unarmed strike: a punch, kick, head-butt, or similar forceful blow (none of which count as weapons). (PHB 195)




        Suggesting that though body parts are not weapons, the unarmed strike still counts as a melee weapon attack but explicitly not a weapon.



        And the Sage Advice Compendium clarifies this and makes it explicit:




        [A]n unarmed strike counts as a melee weapon attack, even though the attacker’s body isn’t considered a weapon.




        Since the smite spells specifically call out a weapon in their description, that is what they require. And since unarmed strikes are not considered to be weapons, then they do not qualify.




        Wrathful smite does not need a weapon



        Wrathful smite is, for some reason, the only smite spell that does not specifically call out the need for a weapon.1




        The first time you hit with a melee weapon attack during the spell's duration, your attack deals an extra 1d6 psychic damage.




        Thus, since the unarmed strikes do count as melee weapon attacks, a character would be able to use an unarmed strike to cause the effect, no weapon required at all.




        1 - Thanks @Someone_Evil for catching this.







        share|improve this answer














        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer








        edited Apr 24 at 15:15

























        answered Apr 24 at 14:10









        RubiksmooseRubiksmoose

        63.4k10306465




        63.4k10306465























            1












            $begingroup$

            I agree with Rubiksmoose's answer that the smite spells (except wrathful smite) require a weapon.



            However, I thought it might be useful to share my own house ruling on the subject. I decreed that, while the resident paladin couldn't use a smite barehanded, a gauntlet could count as a weapon for the purposes of the various smite spells.



            Note that, to the best of my knowledge, gauntlets arent considered weapons anywhere in the RAW. They do, however, provide a way to "disarm" a paladin so that they can't just punch holes through monsters with impunity. I felt it wouldn't break the game too much to tweak the rules in such a fashion, and I honestly wanted to see where she was going with it.



            The paladin eventually took advantage of this ruling to literally backhand a wereboar to death. It was a very cool moment in-game, and I regret nothing. As always, Your Mileage May Vary.






            share|improve this answer











            $endgroup$












            • $begingroup$
              You should summarize the accepted answer's conclusion (instead of just saying you agree with it), so that your answer can stand on its own. I've done it for you this time :)
              $endgroup$
              – V2Blast
              Apr 24 at 22:01











            • $begingroup$
              @V2Blast Kindly appreciated.
              $endgroup$
              – TheVagrantDog
              2 days ago















            1












            $begingroup$

            I agree with Rubiksmoose's answer that the smite spells (except wrathful smite) require a weapon.



            However, I thought it might be useful to share my own house ruling on the subject. I decreed that, while the resident paladin couldn't use a smite barehanded, a gauntlet could count as a weapon for the purposes of the various smite spells.



            Note that, to the best of my knowledge, gauntlets arent considered weapons anywhere in the RAW. They do, however, provide a way to "disarm" a paladin so that they can't just punch holes through monsters with impunity. I felt it wouldn't break the game too much to tweak the rules in such a fashion, and I honestly wanted to see where she was going with it.



            The paladin eventually took advantage of this ruling to literally backhand a wereboar to death. It was a very cool moment in-game, and I regret nothing. As always, Your Mileage May Vary.






            share|improve this answer











            $endgroup$












            • $begingroup$
              You should summarize the accepted answer's conclusion (instead of just saying you agree with it), so that your answer can stand on its own. I've done it for you this time :)
              $endgroup$
              – V2Blast
              Apr 24 at 22:01











            • $begingroup$
              @V2Blast Kindly appreciated.
              $endgroup$
              – TheVagrantDog
              2 days ago













            1












            1








            1





            $begingroup$

            I agree with Rubiksmoose's answer that the smite spells (except wrathful smite) require a weapon.



            However, I thought it might be useful to share my own house ruling on the subject. I decreed that, while the resident paladin couldn't use a smite barehanded, a gauntlet could count as a weapon for the purposes of the various smite spells.



            Note that, to the best of my knowledge, gauntlets arent considered weapons anywhere in the RAW. They do, however, provide a way to "disarm" a paladin so that they can't just punch holes through monsters with impunity. I felt it wouldn't break the game too much to tweak the rules in such a fashion, and I honestly wanted to see where she was going with it.



            The paladin eventually took advantage of this ruling to literally backhand a wereboar to death. It was a very cool moment in-game, and I regret nothing. As always, Your Mileage May Vary.






            share|improve this answer











            $endgroup$



            I agree with Rubiksmoose's answer that the smite spells (except wrathful smite) require a weapon.



            However, I thought it might be useful to share my own house ruling on the subject. I decreed that, while the resident paladin couldn't use a smite barehanded, a gauntlet could count as a weapon for the purposes of the various smite spells.



            Note that, to the best of my knowledge, gauntlets arent considered weapons anywhere in the RAW. They do, however, provide a way to "disarm" a paladin so that they can't just punch holes through monsters with impunity. I felt it wouldn't break the game too much to tweak the rules in such a fashion, and I honestly wanted to see where she was going with it.



            The paladin eventually took advantage of this ruling to literally backhand a wereboar to death. It was a very cool moment in-game, and I regret nothing. As always, Your Mileage May Vary.







            share|improve this answer














            share|improve this answer



            share|improve this answer








            edited Apr 24 at 22:02









            V2Blast

            28.1k5101171




            28.1k5101171










            answered Apr 24 at 19:01









            TheVagrantDogTheVagrantDog

            6,48912043




            6,48912043











            • $begingroup$
              You should summarize the accepted answer's conclusion (instead of just saying you agree with it), so that your answer can stand on its own. I've done it for you this time :)
              $endgroup$
              – V2Blast
              Apr 24 at 22:01











            • $begingroup$
              @V2Blast Kindly appreciated.
              $endgroup$
              – TheVagrantDog
              2 days ago
















            • $begingroup$
              You should summarize the accepted answer's conclusion (instead of just saying you agree with it), so that your answer can stand on its own. I've done it for you this time :)
              $endgroup$
              – V2Blast
              Apr 24 at 22:01











            • $begingroup$
              @V2Blast Kindly appreciated.
              $endgroup$
              – TheVagrantDog
              2 days ago















            $begingroup$
            You should summarize the accepted answer's conclusion (instead of just saying you agree with it), so that your answer can stand on its own. I've done it for you this time :)
            $endgroup$
            – V2Blast
            Apr 24 at 22:01





            $begingroup$
            You should summarize the accepted answer's conclusion (instead of just saying you agree with it), so that your answer can stand on its own. I've done it for you this time :)
            $endgroup$
            – V2Blast
            Apr 24 at 22:01













            $begingroup$
            @V2Blast Kindly appreciated.
            $endgroup$
            – TheVagrantDog
            2 days ago




            $begingroup$
            @V2Blast Kindly appreciated.
            $endgroup$
            – TheVagrantDog
            2 days ago

















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