On The Origin of Dissonant ChordsThe origin of “Battle Ends And Down Goes Charles' Father”Origin of the asymmetrical keyboard layout of a pianoOrigin of the 'squigly line' used for quarter note rest?The melody+chords pattern in perspectiveFind the origin of folkOrigin of the BackbeatWhat is the origin of the triangle symbol for maj7 chords?“The intervals considered dissonant have changed since the 'Middle Ages'”; How so?Origin of Roman Numeral AnalysisPerfect 4th is dissonant?
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On The Origin of Dissonant Chords
The origin of “Battle Ends And Down Goes Charles' Father”Origin of the asymmetrical keyboard layout of a pianoOrigin of the 'squigly line' used for quarter note rest?The melody+chords pattern in perspectiveFind the origin of folkOrigin of the BackbeatWhat is the origin of the triangle symbol for maj7 chords?“The intervals considered dissonant have changed since the 'Middle Ages'”; How so?Origin of Roman Numeral AnalysisPerfect 4th is dissonant?
Without relying upon French harmonic theory (Rameau for instance), can you explain how the emergence of “freely” (by freely, I refer to such harmonies not being the result non-harmonic tones, or through preparations.) used dissonant chords were justified via the principles of the preceding Stile Antico (e.g. Palestrina)?
PS: Schenkerian analysis should be avoided in this discussion owing to its inaccuracies.
harmony history
edited 2 days ago
Richard
46.5k7113199
asked Apr 26 at 11:01
LaprtseniaLaprtsenia
15
New contributor
Laprtsenia is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
add a comment |
Without relying upon French harmonic theory (Rameau for instance), can you explain how the emergence of “freely” (by freely, I refer to such harmonies not being the result non-harmonic tones, or through preparations.) used dissonant chords were justified via the principles of the preceding Stile Antico (e.g. Palestrina)?
PS: Schenkerian analysis should be avoided in this discussion owing to its inaccuracies.
harmony history
edited 2 days ago
Richard
46.5k7113199
asked Apr 26 at 11:01
LaprtseniaLaprtsenia
15
New contributor
Laprtsenia is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
4
And then the theorists decided to play a D7(♭9 ♯9 ♯11 ♭13) chord, and the Lord did grin
– user45266
Apr 26 at 15:11
2
What exactly do you mean by the phrase "the emergence of 'freely' used dissonant chords" ? Specifically, what do you mean "freely"? Are you referring to a specific period where you envision this emergence having occurred?
– John Wu
Apr 27 at 2:13
3
"Schenkerian analysis should be avoided in this discussion owing to its inaccuracies." Tell us how you really feel!
– Richard
Apr 27 at 2:34
2
What do you mean by "freely" (scare quotes yours) used dissonant chords? There is no lack of dissonance in Palestrina, but I'm not aware that they thought of chords in the same manner as we do, so I don't think anything would have been justified in that manner. What are you asking, exactly?
– Ben I.
Apr 27 at 3:11
@Ben I. 3 — But Palestrina and other composers of strict part writing only used triads. I am asking in explicit detail how the freer use of dissonant harmonies emerged (by freer, I mean not being the result of non harmonic tones)
– Laprtsenia
2 days ago
add a comment |
Without relying upon French harmonic theory (Rameau for instance), can you explain how the emergence of “freely” (by freely, I refer to such harmonies not being the result non-harmonic tones, or through preparations.) used dissonant chords were justified via the principles of the preceding Stile Antico (e.g. Palestrina)?
PS: Schenkerian analysis should be avoided in this discussion owing to its inaccuracies.
harmony history
edited 2 days ago
Richard
46.5k7113199
asked Apr 26 at 11:01
LaprtseniaLaprtsenia
15
New contributor
Laprtsenia is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
Without relying upon French harmonic theory (Rameau for instance), can you explain how the emergence of “freely” (by freely, I refer to such harmonies not being the result non-harmonic tones, or through preparations.) used dissonant chords were justified via the principles of the preceding Stile Antico (e.g. Palestrina)?
PS: Schenkerian analysis should be avoided in this discussion owing to its inaccuracies.
harmony history
harmony history
edited 2 days ago
Richard
46.5k7113199
asked Apr 26 at 11:01
LaprtseniaLaprtsenia
15
New contributor
Laprtsenia is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
edited 2 days ago
Richard
46.5k7113199
asked Apr 26 at 11:01
LaprtseniaLaprtsenia
15
New contributor
Laprtsenia is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
edited 2 days ago
Richard
46.5k7113199
edited 2 days ago
Richard
46.5k7113199
edited 2 days ago
Richard
46.5k7113199
46.5k7113199
asked Apr 26 at 11:01
LaprtseniaLaprtsenia
15
New contributor
Laprtsenia is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
asked Apr 26 at 11:01
LaprtseniaLaprtsenia
15
asked Apr 26 at 11:01
LaprtseniaLaprtsenia
15
15
New contributor
Laprtsenia is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
New contributor
Laprtsenia is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
Laprtsenia is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
4
And then the theorists decided to play a D7(♭9 ♯9 ♯11 ♭13) chord, and the Lord did grin
– user45266
Apr 26 at 15:11
2
What exactly do you mean by the phrase "the emergence of 'freely' used dissonant chords" ? Specifically, what do you mean "freely"? Are you referring to a specific period where you envision this emergence having occurred?
– John Wu
Apr 27 at 2:13
3
"Schenkerian analysis should be avoided in this discussion owing to its inaccuracies." Tell us how you really feel!
– Richard
Apr 27 at 2:34
2
What do you mean by "freely" (scare quotes yours) used dissonant chords? There is no lack of dissonance in Palestrina, but I'm not aware that they thought of chords in the same manner as we do, so I don't think anything would have been justified in that manner. What are you asking, exactly?
– Ben I.
Apr 27 at 3:11
@Ben I. 3 — But Palestrina and other composers of strict part writing only used triads. I am asking in explicit detail how the freer use of dissonant harmonies emerged (by freer, I mean not being the result of non harmonic tones)
– Laprtsenia
2 days ago
add a comment |
4
And then the theorists decided to play a D7(♭9 ♯9 ♯11 ♭13) chord, and the Lord did grin
– user45266
Apr 26 at 15:11
2
What exactly do you mean by the phrase "the emergence of 'freely' used dissonant chords" ? Specifically, what do you mean "freely"? Are you referring to a specific period where you envision this emergence having occurred?
– John Wu
Apr 27 at 2:13
3
"Schenkerian analysis should be avoided in this discussion owing to its inaccuracies." Tell us how you really feel!
– Richard
Apr 27 at 2:34
2
What do you mean by "freely" (scare quotes yours) used dissonant chords? There is no lack of dissonance in Palestrina, but I'm not aware that they thought of chords in the same manner as we do, so I don't think anything would have been justified in that manner. What are you asking, exactly?
– Ben I.
Apr 27 at 3:11
@Ben I. 3 — But Palestrina and other composers of strict part writing only used triads. I am asking in explicit detail how the freer use of dissonant harmonies emerged (by freer, I mean not being the result of non harmonic tones)
– Laprtsenia
2 days ago
4
4
And then the theorists decided to play a D7(♭9 ♯9 ♯11 ♭13) chord, and the Lord did grin
– user45266
Apr 26 at 15:11
And then the theorists decided to play a D7(♭9 ♯9 ♯11 ♭13) chord, and the Lord did grin
– user45266
Apr 26 at 15:11
2
2
What exactly do you mean by the phrase "the emergence of 'freely' used dissonant chords" ? Specifically, what do you mean "freely"? Are you referring to a specific period where you envision this emergence having occurred?
– John Wu
Apr 27 at 2:13
What exactly do you mean by the phrase "the emergence of 'freely' used dissonant chords" ? Specifically, what do you mean "freely"? Are you referring to a specific period where you envision this emergence having occurred?
– John Wu
Apr 27 at 2:13
3
3
"Schenkerian analysis should be avoided in this discussion owing to its inaccuracies." Tell us how you really feel!
– Richard
Apr 27 at 2:34
"Schenkerian analysis should be avoided in this discussion owing to its inaccuracies." Tell us how you really feel!
– Richard
Apr 27 at 2:34
2
2
What do you mean by "freely" (scare quotes yours) used dissonant chords? There is no lack of dissonance in Palestrina, but I'm not aware that they thought of chords in the same manner as we do, so I don't think anything would have been justified in that manner. What are you asking, exactly?
– Ben I.
Apr 27 at 3:11
What do you mean by "freely" (scare quotes yours) used dissonant chords? There is no lack of dissonance in Palestrina, but I'm not aware that they thought of chords in the same manner as we do, so I don't think anything would have been justified in that manner. What are you asking, exactly?
– Ben I.
Apr 27 at 3:11
@Ben I. 3 — But Palestrina and other composers of strict part writing only used triads. I am asking in explicit detail how the freer use of dissonant harmonies emerged (by freer, I mean not being the result of non harmonic tones)
– Laprtsenia
2 days ago
@Ben I. 3 — But Palestrina and other composers of strict part writing only used triads. I am asking in explicit detail how the freer use of dissonant harmonies emerged (by freer, I mean not being the result of non harmonic tones)
– Laprtsenia
2 days ago
add a comment |
1 Answer
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Without checking, I would guess that chords (or tone arrangements) generally considered dissonant arose from combinations of melodic lines. The composers (or performers) who generated the music decided that a good melodic line trumped a good harmonic sound.
One sees something similar in the common practice period. Moving bass lines (like a walking bass) often "ignore" the surrounding harmony to move melodically to a scale tone. (One can play C-G-A-B-C against a C major chord without causing too much havoc.) Similarly for melodic lines.
Dissonance isn't "bad sounding" nor "antii-harmonic"; it merely signals the "desire" (or raises the expectation from previous association) of movement. Dissonance also makes the dissonant note (or note cluster) stand out and can be use to highlight a part (instead of just playing a note louder. It adds a sort of accent that is different from (though can work well with) syncopation, loudness, change of register or instrumentation, etc.
answered Apr 26 at 12:28
ttwttw
9,7171035
add a comment |
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Without checking, I would guess that chords (or tone arrangements) generally considered dissonant arose from combinations of melodic lines. The composers (or performers) who generated the music decided that a good melodic line trumped a good harmonic sound.
One sees something similar in the common practice period. Moving bass lines (like a walking bass) often "ignore" the surrounding harmony to move melodically to a scale tone. (One can play C-G-A-B-C against a C major chord without causing too much havoc.) Similarly for melodic lines.
Dissonance isn't "bad sounding" nor "antii-harmonic"; it merely signals the "desire" (or raises the expectation from previous association) of movement. Dissonance also makes the dissonant note (or note cluster) stand out and can be use to highlight a part (instead of just playing a note louder. It adds a sort of accent that is different from (though can work well with) syncopation, loudness, change of register or instrumentation, etc.
answered Apr 26 at 12:28
ttwttw
9,7171035
add a comment |
Without checking, I would guess that chords (or tone arrangements) generally considered dissonant arose from combinations of melodic lines. The composers (or performers) who generated the music decided that a good melodic line trumped a good harmonic sound.
One sees something similar in the common practice period. Moving bass lines (like a walking bass) often "ignore" the surrounding harmony to move melodically to a scale tone. (One can play C-G-A-B-C against a C major chord without causing too much havoc.) Similarly for melodic lines.
Dissonance isn't "bad sounding" nor "antii-harmonic"; it merely signals the "desire" (or raises the expectation from previous association) of movement. Dissonance also makes the dissonant note (or note cluster) stand out and can be use to highlight a part (instead of just playing a note louder. It adds a sort of accent that is different from (though can work well with) syncopation, loudness, change of register or instrumentation, etc.
answered Apr 26 at 12:28
ttwttw
9,7171035
add a comment |
Without checking, I would guess that chords (or tone arrangements) generally considered dissonant arose from combinations of melodic lines. The composers (or performers) who generated the music decided that a good melodic line trumped a good harmonic sound.
One sees something similar in the common practice period. Moving bass lines (like a walking bass) often "ignore" the surrounding harmony to move melodically to a scale tone. (One can play C-G-A-B-C against a C major chord without causing too much havoc.) Similarly for melodic lines.
Dissonance isn't "bad sounding" nor "antii-harmonic"; it merely signals the "desire" (or raises the expectation from previous association) of movement. Dissonance also makes the dissonant note (or note cluster) stand out and can be use to highlight a part (instead of just playing a note louder. It adds a sort of accent that is different from (though can work well with) syncopation, loudness, change of register or instrumentation, etc.
answered Apr 26 at 12:28
ttwttw
9,7171035
Without checking, I would guess that chords (or tone arrangements) generally considered dissonant arose from combinations of melodic lines. The composers (or performers) who generated the music decided that a good melodic line trumped a good harmonic sound.
One sees something similar in the common practice period. Moving bass lines (like a walking bass) often "ignore" the surrounding harmony to move melodically to a scale tone. (One can play C-G-A-B-C against a C major chord without causing too much havoc.) Similarly for melodic lines.
Dissonance isn't "bad sounding" nor "antii-harmonic"; it merely signals the "desire" (or raises the expectation from previous association) of movement. Dissonance also makes the dissonant note (or note cluster) stand out and can be use to highlight a part (instead of just playing a note louder. It adds a sort of accent that is different from (though can work well with) syncopation, loudness, change of register or instrumentation, etc.
answered Apr 26 at 12:28
ttwttw
9,7171035
answered Apr 26 at 12:28
ttwttw
9,7171035
answered Apr 26 at 12:28
ttwttw
9,7171035
answered Apr 26 at 12:28
ttwttw
9,7171035
9,7171035
add a comment |
add a comment |
Laprtsenia is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
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4
And then the theorists decided to play a D7(♭9 ♯9 ♯11 ♭13) chord, and the Lord did grin
– user45266
Apr 26 at 15:11
2
What exactly do you mean by the phrase "the emergence of 'freely' used dissonant chords" ? Specifically, what do you mean "freely"? Are you referring to a specific period where you envision this emergence having occurred?
– John Wu
Apr 27 at 2:13
3
"Schenkerian analysis should be avoided in this discussion owing to its inaccuracies." Tell us how you really feel!
– Richard
Apr 27 at 2:34
2
What do you mean by "freely" (scare quotes yours) used dissonant chords? There is no lack of dissonance in Palestrina, but I'm not aware that they thought of chords in the same manner as we do, so I don't think anything would have been justified in that manner. What are you asking, exactly?
– Ben I.
Apr 27 at 3:11
@Ben I. 3 — But Palestrina and other composers of strict part writing only used triads. I am asking in explicit detail how the freer use of dissonant harmonies emerged (by freer, I mean not being the result of non harmonic tones)
– Laprtsenia
2 days ago