Is Astrology considered scientific? [on hold] The 2019 Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results Are In Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara Planned maintenance scheduled April 17/18, 2019 at 00:00UTC (8:00pm US/Eastern)Is religion different from science ? Especially when it comes to falsifiability of claims?Is our destiny predetermined? If yes, then why do our actions affect our karma?What year is it according to the Hindu Lunar Calendar?what is Nadi Astrology(nāḍi jyotiṣa) in Hindu astrologyDo any Hindu scriptures explain the science behind the astrology?Agastya's Palm Leaf AstrologyAre the planets of our solar system ( like Brihaspati, Shukra, Chandra etc) Devas or the abodes of the respective Devas?Is astrology even true? If it is true, then how these Grahas called Devata become dumb bodies of Moon, Star Sun, Mars etcIs palmistry a part of astrology?What are the astrological combinations in a horoscope that predict the subject will be atheistically inclined?Which time for buying online should be considered as muhurtha?
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Is Astrology considered scientific? [on hold]
The 2019 Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results Are In
Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara
Planned maintenance scheduled April 17/18, 2019 at 00:00UTC (8:00pm US/Eastern)Is religion different from science ? Especially when it comes to falsifiability of claims?Is our destiny predetermined? If yes, then why do our actions affect our karma?What year is it according to the Hindu Lunar Calendar?what is Nadi Astrology(nāḍi jyotiṣa) in Hindu astrologyDo any Hindu scriptures explain the science behind the astrology?Agastya's Palm Leaf AstrologyAre the planets of our solar system ( like Brihaspati, Shukra, Chandra etc) Devas or the abodes of the respective Devas?Is astrology even true? If it is true, then how these Grahas called Devata become dumb bodies of Moon, Star Sun, Mars etcIs palmistry a part of astrology?What are the astrological combinations in a horoscope that predict the subject will be atheistically inclined?Which time for buying online should be considered as muhurtha?
It seems that astrological predictions are trials and error method? Can someone please give some examples that make sense? I have seen many people who are trained to read patris make mistakes which are very basic.
astrology
New contributor
put on hold as off-topic by Aby, Akshay S, CR241, TheLittleNaruto, The Destroyer♦ yesterday
This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:
- "Scientific speculation is off-topic here. See the related meta post for details." – Aby, Akshay S, CR241, TheLittleNaruto, The Destroyer
|
show 9 more comments
It seems that astrological predictions are trials and error method? Can someone please give some examples that make sense? I have seen many people who are trained to read patris make mistakes which are very basic.
astrology
New contributor
put on hold as off-topic by Aby, Akshay S, CR241, TheLittleNaruto, The Destroyer♦ yesterday
This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:
- "Scientific speculation is off-topic here. See the related meta post for details." – Aby, Akshay S, CR241, TheLittleNaruto, The Destroyer
But there are some cases where they do predict the correct answer to certain questions, so that means there is some basis to it. I am just wondering if it the absence of skill to read astrological signs that makes wrong predictions or the method itself is wrong.
– Diwesh kumar
2 days ago
4
Astrology is perfectly true but I don't know about astrologers who don't know calculations. Entirr cosmos is reflection of Pancha bootha, and same with humans too. He has 5 bodies, 5 koshas etc.. each planet is associated with 1 of pancha bootha and their join separation gives effect based on that. Through Astrology chart a true astrologer can easily get all infos about person's bootha, destiny etc .. at least few % of spiritual evolution one should have to understand and do this. There are so much hidden knowledge. So don't write off anything just based on outer view
– Akshay S
2 days ago
There's Sukshma beyond physical. And it is in communication with outside universe, the 9 vayus -Prana Apana vyana udana dhananjeya etc. .. circulate based on how much energy they get from universe. This is deeper subject which science cannot prove simply because they haven't touched subtle currents and without that they will not know!
– Akshay S
2 days ago
THIRD, Scientific discussions are off topic for the site.!
– Akshay S
2 days ago
1
"But there are some cases where they do predict the correct answer to certain questions, so that means there is some basis to it." Sorry I disagree. If a flatearther makes 10 incorrect statements and the 11th is true that doesn't mean the other 10 are correct.
– Wikash_hindu
yesterday
|
show 9 more comments
It seems that astrological predictions are trials and error method? Can someone please give some examples that make sense? I have seen many people who are trained to read patris make mistakes which are very basic.
astrology
New contributor
It seems that astrological predictions are trials and error method? Can someone please give some examples that make sense? I have seen many people who are trained to read patris make mistakes which are very basic.
astrology
astrology
New contributor
New contributor
New contributor
asked 2 days ago
Diwesh kumarDiwesh kumar
526
526
New contributor
New contributor
put on hold as off-topic by Aby, Akshay S, CR241, TheLittleNaruto, The Destroyer♦ yesterday
This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:
- "Scientific speculation is off-topic here. See the related meta post for details." – Aby, Akshay S, CR241, TheLittleNaruto, The Destroyer
put on hold as off-topic by Aby, Akshay S, CR241, TheLittleNaruto, The Destroyer♦ yesterday
This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:
- "Scientific speculation is off-topic here. See the related meta post for details." – Aby, Akshay S, CR241, TheLittleNaruto, The Destroyer
But there are some cases where they do predict the correct answer to certain questions, so that means there is some basis to it. I am just wondering if it the absence of skill to read astrological signs that makes wrong predictions or the method itself is wrong.
– Diwesh kumar
2 days ago
4
Astrology is perfectly true but I don't know about astrologers who don't know calculations. Entirr cosmos is reflection of Pancha bootha, and same with humans too. He has 5 bodies, 5 koshas etc.. each planet is associated with 1 of pancha bootha and their join separation gives effect based on that. Through Astrology chart a true astrologer can easily get all infos about person's bootha, destiny etc .. at least few % of spiritual evolution one should have to understand and do this. There are so much hidden knowledge. So don't write off anything just based on outer view
– Akshay S
2 days ago
There's Sukshma beyond physical. And it is in communication with outside universe, the 9 vayus -Prana Apana vyana udana dhananjeya etc. .. circulate based on how much energy they get from universe. This is deeper subject which science cannot prove simply because they haven't touched subtle currents and without that they will not know!
– Akshay S
2 days ago
THIRD, Scientific discussions are off topic for the site.!
– Akshay S
2 days ago
1
"But there are some cases where they do predict the correct answer to certain questions, so that means there is some basis to it." Sorry I disagree. If a flatearther makes 10 incorrect statements and the 11th is true that doesn't mean the other 10 are correct.
– Wikash_hindu
yesterday
|
show 9 more comments
But there are some cases where they do predict the correct answer to certain questions, so that means there is some basis to it. I am just wondering if it the absence of skill to read astrological signs that makes wrong predictions or the method itself is wrong.
– Diwesh kumar
2 days ago
4
Astrology is perfectly true but I don't know about astrologers who don't know calculations. Entirr cosmos is reflection of Pancha bootha, and same with humans too. He has 5 bodies, 5 koshas etc.. each planet is associated with 1 of pancha bootha and their join separation gives effect based on that. Through Astrology chart a true astrologer can easily get all infos about person's bootha, destiny etc .. at least few % of spiritual evolution one should have to understand and do this. There are so much hidden knowledge. So don't write off anything just based on outer view
– Akshay S
2 days ago
There's Sukshma beyond physical. And it is in communication with outside universe, the 9 vayus -Prana Apana vyana udana dhananjeya etc. .. circulate based on how much energy they get from universe. This is deeper subject which science cannot prove simply because they haven't touched subtle currents and without that they will not know!
– Akshay S
2 days ago
THIRD, Scientific discussions are off topic for the site.!
– Akshay S
2 days ago
1
"But there are some cases where they do predict the correct answer to certain questions, so that means there is some basis to it." Sorry I disagree. If a flatearther makes 10 incorrect statements and the 11th is true that doesn't mean the other 10 are correct.
– Wikash_hindu
yesterday
But there are some cases where they do predict the correct answer to certain questions, so that means there is some basis to it. I am just wondering if it the absence of skill to read astrological signs that makes wrong predictions or the method itself is wrong.
– Diwesh kumar
2 days ago
But there are some cases where they do predict the correct answer to certain questions, so that means there is some basis to it. I am just wondering if it the absence of skill to read astrological signs that makes wrong predictions or the method itself is wrong.
– Diwesh kumar
2 days ago
4
4
Astrology is perfectly true but I don't know about astrologers who don't know calculations. Entirr cosmos is reflection of Pancha bootha, and same with humans too. He has 5 bodies, 5 koshas etc.. each planet is associated with 1 of pancha bootha and their join separation gives effect based on that. Through Astrology chart a true astrologer can easily get all infos about person's bootha, destiny etc .. at least few % of spiritual evolution one should have to understand and do this. There are so much hidden knowledge. So don't write off anything just based on outer view
– Akshay S
2 days ago
Astrology is perfectly true but I don't know about astrologers who don't know calculations. Entirr cosmos is reflection of Pancha bootha, and same with humans too. He has 5 bodies, 5 koshas etc.. each planet is associated with 1 of pancha bootha and their join separation gives effect based on that. Through Astrology chart a true astrologer can easily get all infos about person's bootha, destiny etc .. at least few % of spiritual evolution one should have to understand and do this. There are so much hidden knowledge. So don't write off anything just based on outer view
– Akshay S
2 days ago
There's Sukshma beyond physical. And it is in communication with outside universe, the 9 vayus -Prana Apana vyana udana dhananjeya etc. .. circulate based on how much energy they get from universe. This is deeper subject which science cannot prove simply because they haven't touched subtle currents and without that they will not know!
– Akshay S
2 days ago
There's Sukshma beyond physical. And it is in communication with outside universe, the 9 vayus -Prana Apana vyana udana dhananjeya etc. .. circulate based on how much energy they get from universe. This is deeper subject which science cannot prove simply because they haven't touched subtle currents and without that they will not know!
– Akshay S
2 days ago
THIRD, Scientific discussions are off topic for the site.!
– Akshay S
2 days ago
THIRD, Scientific discussions are off topic for the site.!
– Akshay S
2 days ago
1
1
"But there are some cases where they do predict the correct answer to certain questions, so that means there is some basis to it." Sorry I disagree. If a flatearther makes 10 incorrect statements and the 11th is true that doesn't mean the other 10 are correct.
– Wikash_hindu
yesterday
"But there are some cases where they do predict the correct answer to certain questions, so that means there is some basis to it." Sorry I disagree. If a flatearther makes 10 incorrect statements and the 11th is true that doesn't mean the other 10 are correct.
– Wikash_hindu
yesterday
|
show 9 more comments
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
No, astrology would not be considered scientific. For something to be considered scientific, it would have to be based on the methods and principles of science which astrology is not.
In particular:
- astrological hypotheses are non-falsifiable.
- astrological experiments, interpretations, and conclusions do not follow the scientific method.
- E.g. There are significant biases in astrological practice (selection bias, observational bias, confirmation bias etc.)
Note: I am not passing judgement on whether or not astrology or specific astrologers are right or wrong. I am just saying that it doesn't pass the criteria to be called scientific.
Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
– The Destroyer♦
22 hours ago
add a comment |
No, astrology, Indian or Western, especially the part that deals with predictions, has no scientific basis. The scientific community considers it as pseudoscience i.e., it resembles science but is based on fallacious assumptions.
From An Indian Test of Indian Astrology by Jayant V. Narlikar:
Our Experiment
Our experiment was performed in the university city of Pune (formerly
Poona) about 160 km (100 miles) southeast of Mumbai (formerly Bombay)
in the state of Maharashtra, which is the second-largest in population
and third-largest in area of India’s twenty-five states. Pune itself
has a population of about
3.5 million.
For the experiment I was assisted by Professor Sudhakar Kunte from the
Department of Statistics at Pune University, Narendra Dabholkar from
the Committee for the Eradication of Superstitions, and Prakash
Ghatpande a former professional astrologer who has subsequently turned
into a critic of astrology.
Indian astrologers claim that they are able to tell intelligence from
a person’s horoscope. So volunteers from the Committee for the
Eradication of Superstitions went to different schools and collected
the names of teenage school children rated by their teachers as
mentally bright. They also collected names from special schools for
the mentally handicapped. The destinies of these cases could hardly be
more different, so they were ideal for testing the above claim. From
the collected data we selected 100 bright and 100 mentally handicapped
cases whose age distribution is shown on the next page.
Birth details were obtained from their parents because birth
certificates are rare in India. Professional Indian astrologers
routinely assume that birth details provided by parents are correct,
so our procedure followed the norm. Each horoscope (birth chart) was
calculated by one of us (PG) using commercial astrological software.
All horoscopes were coded and stored in safe custody by Professor
Kunte at Pune University, so that neither the experimenters (our group
of four) nor the astrologers could know the identities of the
individuals.
Conclusion
Our experiment with twenty-seven Indian astrologers judging forty
horoscopes each, and a team of astrologers judging 200 horoscopes,
showed that none were able to tell bright children from mentally
handicapped children better than chance. Our results contradict the
claims of Indian astrologers and are consistent with the many tests of
Western astrologers. In summary, our results are firmly against Indian
astrology being considered as a science.
From Shawn Carlson's A double-blind test of astrology:
CONCLUSIONS
...
We are now in a position to argue a surprisingly strong case against natal astrology
as practiced by reputable astrologers. Great pains were taken to insure that the
experiment was unbiased and to make sure that astrology was given every reasonable
chance to succeed. It failed. Despite the fact that we worked with some of the best
astrologers in the country, recommended by the advising astrologers for their expertise
in astrology and in their ability to use the CPI, despite the fact that every reasonable
suggestion made by the advising astrologers was worked into the experiment, despite the
fact that the astrologers approved the design and predicted 50% as the "minimum" effect
they would expect to see, astrology failed to perform at a level better than chance.
Tested using double-blind methods, the astrologers' predictions proved to be wrong.
Their predicted connection between the positions of the planets and other astronomical
objects at the time of birth and the personalities of test subjects did not exist. The
experiment clearly refutes the astrological hypothesis.
2
the question asked for astrology, not astrologers. "Birth details were obtained from their parents because birth certificates are rare in India." In other words, a possibly flawed experiment leads you to CONCLUDE that astrology has NO SCIENTIFIC BASIS. Sounds like you didn't follow the scientific method yourself.
– ram
2 days ago
'the question asked for astrology, not astrologers' - if you didn't notice, the title of both papers has 'astrology' in it. It is not the experimenters' fault that a majority of Indians even today don't have birth certificates. The very next line says "Professional Indian astrologers routinely assume that birth details provided by parents are correct, so our procedure followed the norm" @ram
– sv.
2 days ago
The other paper says: "Although we preferred birth certificates, hospital or county records, or other 'official' documentation, we also accepted baby books, as long as the birth time was recorded when the child was born. 'Mother's memory' or having the time read over the telephone from a 'documented' source was not acceptable." @ram
– sv.
2 days ago
From the double-blind test performed at UCBerk link - "It is extremely important that any participating astrologers be respected by the astrological community. To this end we contacted N.C.G.R. (National Council for Geocosmic Research)" - yep, since it is extremely important, let's pick astrologers from the west instead of india where it originated.
– ram
2 days ago
From the Indian test link - Of the twenty-seven astrologers who participated, not all provided personal details, but fifteen were hobbyists, eight were professionals, nine had up to ten years of experience, and seventeen had more than ten years of experience.. from all over Maharashtra - yeah, more than half those are 'hobbyists', and from one single state in India. Definitely conclusive evidence that a thousands of years old shastra is imaginative fiction.
– ram
2 days ago
|
show 19 more comments
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
No, astrology would not be considered scientific. For something to be considered scientific, it would have to be based on the methods and principles of science which astrology is not.
In particular:
- astrological hypotheses are non-falsifiable.
- astrological experiments, interpretations, and conclusions do not follow the scientific method.
- E.g. There are significant biases in astrological practice (selection bias, observational bias, confirmation bias etc.)
Note: I am not passing judgement on whether or not astrology or specific astrologers are right or wrong. I am just saying that it doesn't pass the criteria to be called scientific.
Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
– The Destroyer♦
22 hours ago
add a comment |
No, astrology would not be considered scientific. For something to be considered scientific, it would have to be based on the methods and principles of science which astrology is not.
In particular:
- astrological hypotheses are non-falsifiable.
- astrological experiments, interpretations, and conclusions do not follow the scientific method.
- E.g. There are significant biases in astrological practice (selection bias, observational bias, confirmation bias etc.)
Note: I am not passing judgement on whether or not astrology or specific astrologers are right or wrong. I am just saying that it doesn't pass the criteria to be called scientific.
Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
– The Destroyer♦
22 hours ago
add a comment |
No, astrology would not be considered scientific. For something to be considered scientific, it would have to be based on the methods and principles of science which astrology is not.
In particular:
- astrological hypotheses are non-falsifiable.
- astrological experiments, interpretations, and conclusions do not follow the scientific method.
- E.g. There are significant biases in astrological practice (selection bias, observational bias, confirmation bias etc.)
Note: I am not passing judgement on whether or not astrology or specific astrologers are right or wrong. I am just saying that it doesn't pass the criteria to be called scientific.
No, astrology would not be considered scientific. For something to be considered scientific, it would have to be based on the methods and principles of science which astrology is not.
In particular:
- astrological hypotheses are non-falsifiable.
- astrological experiments, interpretations, and conclusions do not follow the scientific method.
- E.g. There are significant biases in astrological practice (selection bias, observational bias, confirmation bias etc.)
Note: I am not passing judgement on whether or not astrology or specific astrologers are right or wrong. I am just saying that it doesn't pass the criteria to be called scientific.
answered 2 days ago
hashablehashable
1,6721118
1,6721118
Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
– The Destroyer♦
22 hours ago
add a comment |
Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
– The Destroyer♦
22 hours ago
Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
– The Destroyer♦
22 hours ago
Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat.
– The Destroyer♦
22 hours ago
add a comment |
No, astrology, Indian or Western, especially the part that deals with predictions, has no scientific basis. The scientific community considers it as pseudoscience i.e., it resembles science but is based on fallacious assumptions.
From An Indian Test of Indian Astrology by Jayant V. Narlikar:
Our Experiment
Our experiment was performed in the university city of Pune (formerly
Poona) about 160 km (100 miles) southeast of Mumbai (formerly Bombay)
in the state of Maharashtra, which is the second-largest in population
and third-largest in area of India’s twenty-five states. Pune itself
has a population of about
3.5 million.
For the experiment I was assisted by Professor Sudhakar Kunte from the
Department of Statistics at Pune University, Narendra Dabholkar from
the Committee for the Eradication of Superstitions, and Prakash
Ghatpande a former professional astrologer who has subsequently turned
into a critic of astrology.
Indian astrologers claim that they are able to tell intelligence from
a person’s horoscope. So volunteers from the Committee for the
Eradication of Superstitions went to different schools and collected
the names of teenage school children rated by their teachers as
mentally bright. They also collected names from special schools for
the mentally handicapped. The destinies of these cases could hardly be
more different, so they were ideal for testing the above claim. From
the collected data we selected 100 bright and 100 mentally handicapped
cases whose age distribution is shown on the next page.
Birth details were obtained from their parents because birth
certificates are rare in India. Professional Indian astrologers
routinely assume that birth details provided by parents are correct,
so our procedure followed the norm. Each horoscope (birth chart) was
calculated by one of us (PG) using commercial astrological software.
All horoscopes were coded and stored in safe custody by Professor
Kunte at Pune University, so that neither the experimenters (our group
of four) nor the astrologers could know the identities of the
individuals.
Conclusion
Our experiment with twenty-seven Indian astrologers judging forty
horoscopes each, and a team of astrologers judging 200 horoscopes,
showed that none were able to tell bright children from mentally
handicapped children better than chance. Our results contradict the
claims of Indian astrologers and are consistent with the many tests of
Western astrologers. In summary, our results are firmly against Indian
astrology being considered as a science.
From Shawn Carlson's A double-blind test of astrology:
CONCLUSIONS
...
We are now in a position to argue a surprisingly strong case against natal astrology
as practiced by reputable astrologers. Great pains were taken to insure that the
experiment was unbiased and to make sure that astrology was given every reasonable
chance to succeed. It failed. Despite the fact that we worked with some of the best
astrologers in the country, recommended by the advising astrologers for their expertise
in astrology and in their ability to use the CPI, despite the fact that every reasonable
suggestion made by the advising astrologers was worked into the experiment, despite the
fact that the astrologers approved the design and predicted 50% as the "minimum" effect
they would expect to see, astrology failed to perform at a level better than chance.
Tested using double-blind methods, the astrologers' predictions proved to be wrong.
Their predicted connection between the positions of the planets and other astronomical
objects at the time of birth and the personalities of test subjects did not exist. The
experiment clearly refutes the astrological hypothesis.
2
the question asked for astrology, not astrologers. "Birth details were obtained from their parents because birth certificates are rare in India." In other words, a possibly flawed experiment leads you to CONCLUDE that astrology has NO SCIENTIFIC BASIS. Sounds like you didn't follow the scientific method yourself.
– ram
2 days ago
'the question asked for astrology, not astrologers' - if you didn't notice, the title of both papers has 'astrology' in it. It is not the experimenters' fault that a majority of Indians even today don't have birth certificates. The very next line says "Professional Indian astrologers routinely assume that birth details provided by parents are correct, so our procedure followed the norm" @ram
– sv.
2 days ago
The other paper says: "Although we preferred birth certificates, hospital or county records, or other 'official' documentation, we also accepted baby books, as long as the birth time was recorded when the child was born. 'Mother's memory' or having the time read over the telephone from a 'documented' source was not acceptable." @ram
– sv.
2 days ago
From the double-blind test performed at UCBerk link - "It is extremely important that any participating astrologers be respected by the astrological community. To this end we contacted N.C.G.R. (National Council for Geocosmic Research)" - yep, since it is extremely important, let's pick astrologers from the west instead of india where it originated.
– ram
2 days ago
From the Indian test link - Of the twenty-seven astrologers who participated, not all provided personal details, but fifteen were hobbyists, eight were professionals, nine had up to ten years of experience, and seventeen had more than ten years of experience.. from all over Maharashtra - yeah, more than half those are 'hobbyists', and from one single state in India. Definitely conclusive evidence that a thousands of years old shastra is imaginative fiction.
– ram
2 days ago
|
show 19 more comments
No, astrology, Indian or Western, especially the part that deals with predictions, has no scientific basis. The scientific community considers it as pseudoscience i.e., it resembles science but is based on fallacious assumptions.
From An Indian Test of Indian Astrology by Jayant V. Narlikar:
Our Experiment
Our experiment was performed in the university city of Pune (formerly
Poona) about 160 km (100 miles) southeast of Mumbai (formerly Bombay)
in the state of Maharashtra, which is the second-largest in population
and third-largest in area of India’s twenty-five states. Pune itself
has a population of about
3.5 million.
For the experiment I was assisted by Professor Sudhakar Kunte from the
Department of Statistics at Pune University, Narendra Dabholkar from
the Committee for the Eradication of Superstitions, and Prakash
Ghatpande a former professional astrologer who has subsequently turned
into a critic of astrology.
Indian astrologers claim that they are able to tell intelligence from
a person’s horoscope. So volunteers from the Committee for the
Eradication of Superstitions went to different schools and collected
the names of teenage school children rated by their teachers as
mentally bright. They also collected names from special schools for
the mentally handicapped. The destinies of these cases could hardly be
more different, so they were ideal for testing the above claim. From
the collected data we selected 100 bright and 100 mentally handicapped
cases whose age distribution is shown on the next page.
Birth details were obtained from their parents because birth
certificates are rare in India. Professional Indian astrologers
routinely assume that birth details provided by parents are correct,
so our procedure followed the norm. Each horoscope (birth chart) was
calculated by one of us (PG) using commercial astrological software.
All horoscopes were coded and stored in safe custody by Professor
Kunte at Pune University, so that neither the experimenters (our group
of four) nor the astrologers could know the identities of the
individuals.
Conclusion
Our experiment with twenty-seven Indian astrologers judging forty
horoscopes each, and a team of astrologers judging 200 horoscopes,
showed that none were able to tell bright children from mentally
handicapped children better than chance. Our results contradict the
claims of Indian astrologers and are consistent with the many tests of
Western astrologers. In summary, our results are firmly against Indian
astrology being considered as a science.
From Shawn Carlson's A double-blind test of astrology:
CONCLUSIONS
...
We are now in a position to argue a surprisingly strong case against natal astrology
as practiced by reputable astrologers. Great pains were taken to insure that the
experiment was unbiased and to make sure that astrology was given every reasonable
chance to succeed. It failed. Despite the fact that we worked with some of the best
astrologers in the country, recommended by the advising astrologers for their expertise
in astrology and in their ability to use the CPI, despite the fact that every reasonable
suggestion made by the advising astrologers was worked into the experiment, despite the
fact that the astrologers approved the design and predicted 50% as the "minimum" effect
they would expect to see, astrology failed to perform at a level better than chance.
Tested using double-blind methods, the astrologers' predictions proved to be wrong.
Their predicted connection between the positions of the planets and other astronomical
objects at the time of birth and the personalities of test subjects did not exist. The
experiment clearly refutes the astrological hypothesis.
2
the question asked for astrology, not astrologers. "Birth details were obtained from their parents because birth certificates are rare in India." In other words, a possibly flawed experiment leads you to CONCLUDE that astrology has NO SCIENTIFIC BASIS. Sounds like you didn't follow the scientific method yourself.
– ram
2 days ago
'the question asked for astrology, not astrologers' - if you didn't notice, the title of both papers has 'astrology' in it. It is not the experimenters' fault that a majority of Indians even today don't have birth certificates. The very next line says "Professional Indian astrologers routinely assume that birth details provided by parents are correct, so our procedure followed the norm" @ram
– sv.
2 days ago
The other paper says: "Although we preferred birth certificates, hospital or county records, or other 'official' documentation, we also accepted baby books, as long as the birth time was recorded when the child was born. 'Mother's memory' or having the time read over the telephone from a 'documented' source was not acceptable." @ram
– sv.
2 days ago
From the double-blind test performed at UCBerk link - "It is extremely important that any participating astrologers be respected by the astrological community. To this end we contacted N.C.G.R. (National Council for Geocosmic Research)" - yep, since it is extremely important, let's pick astrologers from the west instead of india where it originated.
– ram
2 days ago
From the Indian test link - Of the twenty-seven astrologers who participated, not all provided personal details, but fifteen were hobbyists, eight were professionals, nine had up to ten years of experience, and seventeen had more than ten years of experience.. from all over Maharashtra - yeah, more than half those are 'hobbyists', and from one single state in India. Definitely conclusive evidence that a thousands of years old shastra is imaginative fiction.
– ram
2 days ago
|
show 19 more comments
No, astrology, Indian or Western, especially the part that deals with predictions, has no scientific basis. The scientific community considers it as pseudoscience i.e., it resembles science but is based on fallacious assumptions.
From An Indian Test of Indian Astrology by Jayant V. Narlikar:
Our Experiment
Our experiment was performed in the university city of Pune (formerly
Poona) about 160 km (100 miles) southeast of Mumbai (formerly Bombay)
in the state of Maharashtra, which is the second-largest in population
and third-largest in area of India’s twenty-five states. Pune itself
has a population of about
3.5 million.
For the experiment I was assisted by Professor Sudhakar Kunte from the
Department of Statistics at Pune University, Narendra Dabholkar from
the Committee for the Eradication of Superstitions, and Prakash
Ghatpande a former professional astrologer who has subsequently turned
into a critic of astrology.
Indian astrologers claim that they are able to tell intelligence from
a person’s horoscope. So volunteers from the Committee for the
Eradication of Superstitions went to different schools and collected
the names of teenage school children rated by their teachers as
mentally bright. They also collected names from special schools for
the mentally handicapped. The destinies of these cases could hardly be
more different, so they were ideal for testing the above claim. From
the collected data we selected 100 bright and 100 mentally handicapped
cases whose age distribution is shown on the next page.
Birth details were obtained from their parents because birth
certificates are rare in India. Professional Indian astrologers
routinely assume that birth details provided by parents are correct,
so our procedure followed the norm. Each horoscope (birth chart) was
calculated by one of us (PG) using commercial astrological software.
All horoscopes were coded and stored in safe custody by Professor
Kunte at Pune University, so that neither the experimenters (our group
of four) nor the astrologers could know the identities of the
individuals.
Conclusion
Our experiment with twenty-seven Indian astrologers judging forty
horoscopes each, and a team of astrologers judging 200 horoscopes,
showed that none were able to tell bright children from mentally
handicapped children better than chance. Our results contradict the
claims of Indian astrologers and are consistent with the many tests of
Western astrologers. In summary, our results are firmly against Indian
astrology being considered as a science.
From Shawn Carlson's A double-blind test of astrology:
CONCLUSIONS
...
We are now in a position to argue a surprisingly strong case against natal astrology
as practiced by reputable astrologers. Great pains were taken to insure that the
experiment was unbiased and to make sure that astrology was given every reasonable
chance to succeed. It failed. Despite the fact that we worked with some of the best
astrologers in the country, recommended by the advising astrologers for their expertise
in astrology and in their ability to use the CPI, despite the fact that every reasonable
suggestion made by the advising astrologers was worked into the experiment, despite the
fact that the astrologers approved the design and predicted 50% as the "minimum" effect
they would expect to see, astrology failed to perform at a level better than chance.
Tested using double-blind methods, the astrologers' predictions proved to be wrong.
Their predicted connection between the positions of the planets and other astronomical
objects at the time of birth and the personalities of test subjects did not exist. The
experiment clearly refutes the astrological hypothesis.
No, astrology, Indian or Western, especially the part that deals with predictions, has no scientific basis. The scientific community considers it as pseudoscience i.e., it resembles science but is based on fallacious assumptions.
From An Indian Test of Indian Astrology by Jayant V. Narlikar:
Our Experiment
Our experiment was performed in the university city of Pune (formerly
Poona) about 160 km (100 miles) southeast of Mumbai (formerly Bombay)
in the state of Maharashtra, which is the second-largest in population
and third-largest in area of India’s twenty-five states. Pune itself
has a population of about
3.5 million.
For the experiment I was assisted by Professor Sudhakar Kunte from the
Department of Statistics at Pune University, Narendra Dabholkar from
the Committee for the Eradication of Superstitions, and Prakash
Ghatpande a former professional astrologer who has subsequently turned
into a critic of astrology.
Indian astrologers claim that they are able to tell intelligence from
a person’s horoscope. So volunteers from the Committee for the
Eradication of Superstitions went to different schools and collected
the names of teenage school children rated by their teachers as
mentally bright. They also collected names from special schools for
the mentally handicapped. The destinies of these cases could hardly be
more different, so they were ideal for testing the above claim. From
the collected data we selected 100 bright and 100 mentally handicapped
cases whose age distribution is shown on the next page.
Birth details were obtained from their parents because birth
certificates are rare in India. Professional Indian astrologers
routinely assume that birth details provided by parents are correct,
so our procedure followed the norm. Each horoscope (birth chart) was
calculated by one of us (PG) using commercial astrological software.
All horoscopes were coded and stored in safe custody by Professor
Kunte at Pune University, so that neither the experimenters (our group
of four) nor the astrologers could know the identities of the
individuals.
Conclusion
Our experiment with twenty-seven Indian astrologers judging forty
horoscopes each, and a team of astrologers judging 200 horoscopes,
showed that none were able to tell bright children from mentally
handicapped children better than chance. Our results contradict the
claims of Indian astrologers and are consistent with the many tests of
Western astrologers. In summary, our results are firmly against Indian
astrology being considered as a science.
From Shawn Carlson's A double-blind test of astrology:
CONCLUSIONS
...
We are now in a position to argue a surprisingly strong case against natal astrology
as practiced by reputable astrologers. Great pains were taken to insure that the
experiment was unbiased and to make sure that astrology was given every reasonable
chance to succeed. It failed. Despite the fact that we worked with some of the best
astrologers in the country, recommended by the advising astrologers for their expertise
in astrology and in their ability to use the CPI, despite the fact that every reasonable
suggestion made by the advising astrologers was worked into the experiment, despite the
fact that the astrologers approved the design and predicted 50% as the "minimum" effect
they would expect to see, astrology failed to perform at a level better than chance.
Tested using double-blind methods, the astrologers' predictions proved to be wrong.
Their predicted connection between the positions of the planets and other astronomical
objects at the time of birth and the personalities of test subjects did not exist. The
experiment clearly refutes the astrological hypothesis.
answered 2 days ago
sv.sv.
14.2k848113
14.2k848113
2
the question asked for astrology, not astrologers. "Birth details were obtained from their parents because birth certificates are rare in India." In other words, a possibly flawed experiment leads you to CONCLUDE that astrology has NO SCIENTIFIC BASIS. Sounds like you didn't follow the scientific method yourself.
– ram
2 days ago
'the question asked for astrology, not astrologers' - if you didn't notice, the title of both papers has 'astrology' in it. It is not the experimenters' fault that a majority of Indians even today don't have birth certificates. The very next line says "Professional Indian astrologers routinely assume that birth details provided by parents are correct, so our procedure followed the norm" @ram
– sv.
2 days ago
The other paper says: "Although we preferred birth certificates, hospital or county records, or other 'official' documentation, we also accepted baby books, as long as the birth time was recorded when the child was born. 'Mother's memory' or having the time read over the telephone from a 'documented' source was not acceptable." @ram
– sv.
2 days ago
From the double-blind test performed at UCBerk link - "It is extremely important that any participating astrologers be respected by the astrological community. To this end we contacted N.C.G.R. (National Council for Geocosmic Research)" - yep, since it is extremely important, let's pick astrologers from the west instead of india where it originated.
– ram
2 days ago
From the Indian test link - Of the twenty-seven astrologers who participated, not all provided personal details, but fifteen were hobbyists, eight were professionals, nine had up to ten years of experience, and seventeen had more than ten years of experience.. from all over Maharashtra - yeah, more than half those are 'hobbyists', and from one single state in India. Definitely conclusive evidence that a thousands of years old shastra is imaginative fiction.
– ram
2 days ago
|
show 19 more comments
2
the question asked for astrology, not astrologers. "Birth details were obtained from their parents because birth certificates are rare in India." In other words, a possibly flawed experiment leads you to CONCLUDE that astrology has NO SCIENTIFIC BASIS. Sounds like you didn't follow the scientific method yourself.
– ram
2 days ago
'the question asked for astrology, not astrologers' - if you didn't notice, the title of both papers has 'astrology' in it. It is not the experimenters' fault that a majority of Indians even today don't have birth certificates. The very next line says "Professional Indian astrologers routinely assume that birth details provided by parents are correct, so our procedure followed the norm" @ram
– sv.
2 days ago
The other paper says: "Although we preferred birth certificates, hospital or county records, or other 'official' documentation, we also accepted baby books, as long as the birth time was recorded when the child was born. 'Mother's memory' or having the time read over the telephone from a 'documented' source was not acceptable." @ram
– sv.
2 days ago
From the double-blind test performed at UCBerk link - "It is extremely important that any participating astrologers be respected by the astrological community. To this end we contacted N.C.G.R. (National Council for Geocosmic Research)" - yep, since it is extremely important, let's pick astrologers from the west instead of india where it originated.
– ram
2 days ago
From the Indian test link - Of the twenty-seven astrologers who participated, not all provided personal details, but fifteen were hobbyists, eight were professionals, nine had up to ten years of experience, and seventeen had more than ten years of experience.. from all over Maharashtra - yeah, more than half those are 'hobbyists', and from one single state in India. Definitely conclusive evidence that a thousands of years old shastra is imaginative fiction.
– ram
2 days ago
2
2
the question asked for astrology, not astrologers. "Birth details were obtained from their parents because birth certificates are rare in India." In other words, a possibly flawed experiment leads you to CONCLUDE that astrology has NO SCIENTIFIC BASIS. Sounds like you didn't follow the scientific method yourself.
– ram
2 days ago
the question asked for astrology, not astrologers. "Birth details were obtained from their parents because birth certificates are rare in India." In other words, a possibly flawed experiment leads you to CONCLUDE that astrology has NO SCIENTIFIC BASIS. Sounds like you didn't follow the scientific method yourself.
– ram
2 days ago
'the question asked for astrology, not astrologers' - if you didn't notice, the title of both papers has 'astrology' in it. It is not the experimenters' fault that a majority of Indians even today don't have birth certificates. The very next line says "Professional Indian astrologers routinely assume that birth details provided by parents are correct, so our procedure followed the norm" @ram
– sv.
2 days ago
'the question asked for astrology, not astrologers' - if you didn't notice, the title of both papers has 'astrology' in it. It is not the experimenters' fault that a majority of Indians even today don't have birth certificates. The very next line says "Professional Indian astrologers routinely assume that birth details provided by parents are correct, so our procedure followed the norm" @ram
– sv.
2 days ago
The other paper says: "Although we preferred birth certificates, hospital or county records, or other 'official' documentation, we also accepted baby books, as long as the birth time was recorded when the child was born. 'Mother's memory' or having the time read over the telephone from a 'documented' source was not acceptable." @ram
– sv.
2 days ago
The other paper says: "Although we preferred birth certificates, hospital or county records, or other 'official' documentation, we also accepted baby books, as long as the birth time was recorded when the child was born. 'Mother's memory' or having the time read over the telephone from a 'documented' source was not acceptable." @ram
– sv.
2 days ago
From the double-blind test performed at UCBerk link - "It is extremely important that any participating astrologers be respected by the astrological community. To this end we contacted N.C.G.R. (National Council for Geocosmic Research)" - yep, since it is extremely important, let's pick astrologers from the west instead of india where it originated.
– ram
2 days ago
From the double-blind test performed at UCBerk link - "It is extremely important that any participating astrologers be respected by the astrological community. To this end we contacted N.C.G.R. (National Council for Geocosmic Research)" - yep, since it is extremely important, let's pick astrologers from the west instead of india where it originated.
– ram
2 days ago
From the Indian test link - Of the twenty-seven astrologers who participated, not all provided personal details, but fifteen were hobbyists, eight were professionals, nine had up to ten years of experience, and seventeen had more than ten years of experience.. from all over Maharashtra - yeah, more than half those are 'hobbyists', and from one single state in India. Definitely conclusive evidence that a thousands of years old shastra is imaginative fiction.
– ram
2 days ago
From the Indian test link - Of the twenty-seven astrologers who participated, not all provided personal details, but fifteen were hobbyists, eight were professionals, nine had up to ten years of experience, and seventeen had more than ten years of experience.. from all over Maharashtra - yeah, more than half those are 'hobbyists', and from one single state in India. Definitely conclusive evidence that a thousands of years old shastra is imaginative fiction.
– ram
2 days ago
|
show 19 more comments
But there are some cases where they do predict the correct answer to certain questions, so that means there is some basis to it. I am just wondering if it the absence of skill to read astrological signs that makes wrong predictions or the method itself is wrong.
– Diwesh kumar
2 days ago
4
Astrology is perfectly true but I don't know about astrologers who don't know calculations. Entirr cosmos is reflection of Pancha bootha, and same with humans too. He has 5 bodies, 5 koshas etc.. each planet is associated with 1 of pancha bootha and their join separation gives effect based on that. Through Astrology chart a true astrologer can easily get all infos about person's bootha, destiny etc .. at least few % of spiritual evolution one should have to understand and do this. There are so much hidden knowledge. So don't write off anything just based on outer view
– Akshay S
2 days ago
There's Sukshma beyond physical. And it is in communication with outside universe, the 9 vayus -Prana Apana vyana udana dhananjeya etc. .. circulate based on how much energy they get from universe. This is deeper subject which science cannot prove simply because they haven't touched subtle currents and without that they will not know!
– Akshay S
2 days ago
THIRD, Scientific discussions are off topic for the site.!
– Akshay S
2 days ago
1
"But there are some cases where they do predict the correct answer to certain questions, so that means there is some basis to it." Sorry I disagree. If a flatearther makes 10 incorrect statements and the 11th is true that doesn't mean the other 10 are correct.
– Wikash_hindu
yesterday