Is one supposed to eat the zero'ah (shank bone) from the Seder plate? The 2019 Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results Are InPesach/Passover Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara Planned maintenance scheduled April 17/18, 2019 at 00:00UTC (8:00pm US/Eastern) Best answer contest: Second quarter of 5779 To celebrate Mi Yodeya's tenth birthday, let's divide and conquer the entire…Preparing the Beitzah for the Seder PlateWhy a Beitzah on the Seder Plate?Preparing a dish on Shabbos by night for the day time (in regards to Borer)The text of the fourth question at the sederSeder Plate According to the Vilna GaonThe Seder Plate according to the RamaDid Hillel include the Passover lamb in his sandwich or not?Obligation of 'Seder Plate'Why not cook a z'roa just for the seder plate, in light of mitoch?Why read the hagadda on Shabbos Hagadol?

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Is one supposed to eat the zero'ah (shank bone) from the Seder plate?



The 2019 Stack Overflow Developer Survey Results Are In
Pesach/Passover
Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara
Planned maintenance scheduled April 17/18, 2019 at 00:00UTC (8:00pm US/Eastern)
Best answer contest: Second quarter of 5779
To celebrate Mi Yodeya's tenth birthday, let's divide and conquer the entire…Preparing the Beitzah for the Seder PlateWhy a Beitzah on the Seder Plate?Preparing a dish on Shabbos by night for the day time (in regards to Borer)The text of the fourth question at the sederSeder Plate According to the Vilna GaonThe Seder Plate according to the RamaDid Hillel include the Passover lamb in his sandwich or not?Obligation of 'Seder Plate'Why not cook a z'roa just for the seder plate, in light of mitoch?Why read the hagadda on Shabbos Hagadol?










1















I'd appreciate some clarity on this issue as I have heard and seen conflicting answers on this - in viewing various questions on this site as well as instructions in a haggadah. Here's some of what I have seen:




  • The shank bone symbolizes the Pesach sacrifice. However, as there is no Bet Hamikdash, we can't offer the Pesach lamb. So there seems to be two customs regarding avoiding demonstrating that we are eating the Pesach lamb:



    • Many people have the custom not to eat roasted meat

    • When we say "Pesach zu" in the Maggid section, we don't point to the bone on the seder plate, whereas we point / lift the matzah and maror.

    Thus, following these precedents, I would assume that one should not eat the bone.



However:



  • I have read that one must eat the bone since food prepared for that day of Pesach must be eaten that day and not the next day. Otherwise, this becomes a problem of preparing from one day to the next. So, should you eat it as part of the Seder meal, or should you wait until the morning, or what? And why would waiting matter, anyway?

However:



If the bone was prepared before Yom Tov, why would there be any problem of hachanah? So, we're back to the idea, maybe we shouldn't eat it.



In short, what's the "final word" on this?










share|improve this question






















  • Only on a site for Judaism can a yes or no question receive three answers.

    – DonielF
    2 days ago






  • 1





    @DonielF I guess Tevye was right to claim that more than 2 people can be right on a yes / no question. Seeing this, here, is starting to make we wonder if I should put a bounty on this question - just for curiosity to see how much more confusing this would be.

    – DanF
    yesterday















1















I'd appreciate some clarity on this issue as I have heard and seen conflicting answers on this - in viewing various questions on this site as well as instructions in a haggadah. Here's some of what I have seen:




  • The shank bone symbolizes the Pesach sacrifice. However, as there is no Bet Hamikdash, we can't offer the Pesach lamb. So there seems to be two customs regarding avoiding demonstrating that we are eating the Pesach lamb:



    • Many people have the custom not to eat roasted meat

    • When we say "Pesach zu" in the Maggid section, we don't point to the bone on the seder plate, whereas we point / lift the matzah and maror.

    Thus, following these precedents, I would assume that one should not eat the bone.



However:



  • I have read that one must eat the bone since food prepared for that day of Pesach must be eaten that day and not the next day. Otherwise, this becomes a problem of preparing from one day to the next. So, should you eat it as part of the Seder meal, or should you wait until the morning, or what? And why would waiting matter, anyway?

However:



If the bone was prepared before Yom Tov, why would there be any problem of hachanah? So, we're back to the idea, maybe we shouldn't eat it.



In short, what's the "final word" on this?










share|improve this question






















  • Only on a site for Judaism can a yes or no question receive three answers.

    – DonielF
    2 days ago






  • 1





    @DonielF I guess Tevye was right to claim that more than 2 people can be right on a yes / no question. Seeing this, here, is starting to make we wonder if I should put a bounty on this question - just for curiosity to see how much more confusing this would be.

    – DanF
    yesterday













1












1








1








I'd appreciate some clarity on this issue as I have heard and seen conflicting answers on this - in viewing various questions on this site as well as instructions in a haggadah. Here's some of what I have seen:




  • The shank bone symbolizes the Pesach sacrifice. However, as there is no Bet Hamikdash, we can't offer the Pesach lamb. So there seems to be two customs regarding avoiding demonstrating that we are eating the Pesach lamb:



    • Many people have the custom not to eat roasted meat

    • When we say "Pesach zu" in the Maggid section, we don't point to the bone on the seder plate, whereas we point / lift the matzah and maror.

    Thus, following these precedents, I would assume that one should not eat the bone.



However:



  • I have read that one must eat the bone since food prepared for that day of Pesach must be eaten that day and not the next day. Otherwise, this becomes a problem of preparing from one day to the next. So, should you eat it as part of the Seder meal, or should you wait until the morning, or what? And why would waiting matter, anyway?

However:



If the bone was prepared before Yom Tov, why would there be any problem of hachanah? So, we're back to the idea, maybe we shouldn't eat it.



In short, what's the "final word" on this?










share|improve this question














I'd appreciate some clarity on this issue as I have heard and seen conflicting answers on this - in viewing various questions on this site as well as instructions in a haggadah. Here's some of what I have seen:




  • The shank bone symbolizes the Pesach sacrifice. However, as there is no Bet Hamikdash, we can't offer the Pesach lamb. So there seems to be two customs regarding avoiding demonstrating that we are eating the Pesach lamb:



    • Many people have the custom not to eat roasted meat

    • When we say "Pesach zu" in the Maggid section, we don't point to the bone on the seder plate, whereas we point / lift the matzah and maror.

    Thus, following these precedents, I would assume that one should not eat the bone.



However:



  • I have read that one must eat the bone since food prepared for that day of Pesach must be eaten that day and not the next day. Otherwise, this becomes a problem of preparing from one day to the next. So, should you eat it as part of the Seder meal, or should you wait until the morning, or what? And why would waiting matter, anyway?

However:



If the bone was prepared before Yom Tov, why would there be any problem of hachanah? So, we're back to the idea, maybe we shouldn't eat it.



In short, what's the "final word" on this?







food passover-seder-hagada






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share|improve this question










asked 2 days ago









DanFDanF

35.4k528136




35.4k528136












  • Only on a site for Judaism can a yes or no question receive three answers.

    – DonielF
    2 days ago






  • 1





    @DonielF I guess Tevye was right to claim that more than 2 people can be right on a yes / no question. Seeing this, here, is starting to make we wonder if I should put a bounty on this question - just for curiosity to see how much more confusing this would be.

    – DanF
    yesterday

















  • Only on a site for Judaism can a yes or no question receive three answers.

    – DonielF
    2 days ago






  • 1





    @DonielF I guess Tevye was right to claim that more than 2 people can be right on a yes / no question. Seeing this, here, is starting to make we wonder if I should put a bounty on this question - just for curiosity to see how much more confusing this would be.

    – DanF
    yesterday
















Only on a site for Judaism can a yes or no question receive three answers.

– DonielF
2 days ago





Only on a site for Judaism can a yes or no question receive three answers.

– DonielF
2 days ago




1




1





@DonielF I guess Tevye was right to claim that more than 2 people can be right on a yes / no question. Seeing this, here, is starting to make we wonder if I should put a bounty on this question - just for curiosity to see how much more confusing this would be.

– DanF
yesterday





@DonielF I guess Tevye was right to claim that more than 2 people can be right on a yes / no question. Seeing this, here, is starting to make we wonder if I should put a bounty on this question - just for curiosity to see how much more confusing this would be.

– DanF
yesterday










3 Answers
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3














The Darkei Moshe (Rema) Orach CHaim 475,10 gives the final verdict:




כתב מהרי"ו בדרשותיו שצריך לצלות הזרוע והביצה מבע"י דהואיל שאינו אוכלו בי"ט אסור לצלותו בי"ט ונראה דאם רוצה לאכלו בי"ט ראשון ולעשות אחרות לליל י"ט שני דרשות בידו ואז יוכל לצלות אף בי"ט הואיל שאכלו באותו יום ולא כתב מהרי"ו אלא לפי המנהג שנוהגים להשהותו עד ליל ב':

The Mahariv says one should roast the meat on the bone and the egg during the day before Yom Tov since one does not eat the meat on the bone rather he keeps them till the second night of Seder to use again (it is forbidden to cook from one day of Yomtov for the sake of the next day unless its Shabbos where one requires an Eruv Tavshilin).

But it seems that as long as one intends to eat the meat of the bone or the egg during that Yom tov day's meal (As the meat which is roasted one should avoid eating on seder night as noted Shulchan Aruch 476,2) one can roast the bone with its meat on Seder night as one will eat it on the same day as it was cooked. One can then roast another bone with meat on the second night of seder for usage during Seder as one of the two cooked foods as long as he eats it the next day for the second Yom tov day meal. Even the Mahariv would have agreed to this had the minhag in his place not been to keep the same zeroa for both days.




  • So when cooking Zeroa on Pesach night one must eat it the next day and make a new one on second night of seder.

  • But if one cooks the zeroa on the day before Pesach one does not need to eat the bone meat rather keep it for both Seder nights and optionally eat it during the second day meal.

  • Note: The bone should have meat as the Darkei Moshe ibid, 8 says עצם בלא בשר לא מיקרי תבשיל לכן צריך שיהא מעט בשר סריך עליו





share|improve this answer
































    2














    Mishna Berura 473.4 sk 32




    (לב) וכן נוהגין בעירנו - לצלות הביצה. ואסור לאכול הזרוע בלילה דאין אוכלין צלי בלילה אבל הביצה אף שהיא צלויה מותר שאין איסור צלי בביצה ולפ"ז אסור לצלות הזרוע בלילה אלא מבעו"י אם לא שדעתו לאכלו למחר באותו היום וע"כ אם שכח וצלאו בלילה יזהר לאכלו מחר בבקר כ"כ המ"א ושארי אחרונים ואם דעתו שלא לאכול הביצה עד ליל ב' גם הביצה אסור לצלותה בלילה אלא מבעוד יום. כתב בח"א רע עלי המעשה שזורקין הזרוע והוא ביזוי מצוה. ומצוה להניח ביו"ט שני בבקר לתוך הצלי שצולין ליו"ט ואוכלין אותו:




    At the end of the sk he quotes Chaye Adam who feels with the fact that some persons throw the zroa in the Bin. This is disrespectful for the mitsva to put it at the second day of pesach with the meat they grill for Yom Tov. This explanation has nothing to do when the zroa was grilled.






    share|improve this answer






























      1














      Ben Ish Chay (Tzav 30) says not to eat it the first night or day of Pesach, but that you can roast it on Pesach anyway if you forgot to do so before Pesach. He implies that his responsum collection Mikavtziel may explain why, but I don't have a copy or see one online.






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        3 Answers
        3






        active

        oldest

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        3 Answers
        3






        active

        oldest

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        active

        oldest

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        active

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        3














        The Darkei Moshe (Rema) Orach CHaim 475,10 gives the final verdict:




        כתב מהרי"ו בדרשותיו שצריך לצלות הזרוע והביצה מבע"י דהואיל שאינו אוכלו בי"ט אסור לצלותו בי"ט ונראה דאם רוצה לאכלו בי"ט ראשון ולעשות אחרות לליל י"ט שני דרשות בידו ואז יוכל לצלות אף בי"ט הואיל שאכלו באותו יום ולא כתב מהרי"ו אלא לפי המנהג שנוהגים להשהותו עד ליל ב':

        The Mahariv says one should roast the meat on the bone and the egg during the day before Yom Tov since one does not eat the meat on the bone rather he keeps them till the second night of Seder to use again (it is forbidden to cook from one day of Yomtov for the sake of the next day unless its Shabbos where one requires an Eruv Tavshilin).

        But it seems that as long as one intends to eat the meat of the bone or the egg during that Yom tov day's meal (As the meat which is roasted one should avoid eating on seder night as noted Shulchan Aruch 476,2) one can roast the bone with its meat on Seder night as one will eat it on the same day as it was cooked. One can then roast another bone with meat on the second night of seder for usage during Seder as one of the two cooked foods as long as he eats it the next day for the second Yom tov day meal. Even the Mahariv would have agreed to this had the minhag in his place not been to keep the same zeroa for both days.




        • So when cooking Zeroa on Pesach night one must eat it the next day and make a new one on second night of seder.

        • But if one cooks the zeroa on the day before Pesach one does not need to eat the bone meat rather keep it for both Seder nights and optionally eat it during the second day meal.

        • Note: The bone should have meat as the Darkei Moshe ibid, 8 says עצם בלא בשר לא מיקרי תבשיל לכן צריך שיהא מעט בשר סריך עליו





        share|improve this answer





























          3














          The Darkei Moshe (Rema) Orach CHaim 475,10 gives the final verdict:




          כתב מהרי"ו בדרשותיו שצריך לצלות הזרוע והביצה מבע"י דהואיל שאינו אוכלו בי"ט אסור לצלותו בי"ט ונראה דאם רוצה לאכלו בי"ט ראשון ולעשות אחרות לליל י"ט שני דרשות בידו ואז יוכל לצלות אף בי"ט הואיל שאכלו באותו יום ולא כתב מהרי"ו אלא לפי המנהג שנוהגים להשהותו עד ליל ב':

          The Mahariv says one should roast the meat on the bone and the egg during the day before Yom Tov since one does not eat the meat on the bone rather he keeps them till the second night of Seder to use again (it is forbidden to cook from one day of Yomtov for the sake of the next day unless its Shabbos where one requires an Eruv Tavshilin).

          But it seems that as long as one intends to eat the meat of the bone or the egg during that Yom tov day's meal (As the meat which is roasted one should avoid eating on seder night as noted Shulchan Aruch 476,2) one can roast the bone with its meat on Seder night as one will eat it on the same day as it was cooked. One can then roast another bone with meat on the second night of seder for usage during Seder as one of the two cooked foods as long as he eats it the next day for the second Yom tov day meal. Even the Mahariv would have agreed to this had the minhag in his place not been to keep the same zeroa for both days.




          • So when cooking Zeroa on Pesach night one must eat it the next day and make a new one on second night of seder.

          • But if one cooks the zeroa on the day before Pesach one does not need to eat the bone meat rather keep it for both Seder nights and optionally eat it during the second day meal.

          • Note: The bone should have meat as the Darkei Moshe ibid, 8 says עצם בלא בשר לא מיקרי תבשיל לכן צריך שיהא מעט בשר סריך עליו





          share|improve this answer



























            3












            3








            3







            The Darkei Moshe (Rema) Orach CHaim 475,10 gives the final verdict:




            כתב מהרי"ו בדרשותיו שצריך לצלות הזרוע והביצה מבע"י דהואיל שאינו אוכלו בי"ט אסור לצלותו בי"ט ונראה דאם רוצה לאכלו בי"ט ראשון ולעשות אחרות לליל י"ט שני דרשות בידו ואז יוכל לצלות אף בי"ט הואיל שאכלו באותו יום ולא כתב מהרי"ו אלא לפי המנהג שנוהגים להשהותו עד ליל ב':

            The Mahariv says one should roast the meat on the bone and the egg during the day before Yom Tov since one does not eat the meat on the bone rather he keeps them till the second night of Seder to use again (it is forbidden to cook from one day of Yomtov for the sake of the next day unless its Shabbos where one requires an Eruv Tavshilin).

            But it seems that as long as one intends to eat the meat of the bone or the egg during that Yom tov day's meal (As the meat which is roasted one should avoid eating on seder night as noted Shulchan Aruch 476,2) one can roast the bone with its meat on Seder night as one will eat it on the same day as it was cooked. One can then roast another bone with meat on the second night of seder for usage during Seder as one of the two cooked foods as long as he eats it the next day for the second Yom tov day meal. Even the Mahariv would have agreed to this had the minhag in his place not been to keep the same zeroa for both days.




            • So when cooking Zeroa on Pesach night one must eat it the next day and make a new one on second night of seder.

            • But if one cooks the zeroa on the day before Pesach one does not need to eat the bone meat rather keep it for both Seder nights and optionally eat it during the second day meal.

            • Note: The bone should have meat as the Darkei Moshe ibid, 8 says עצם בלא בשר לא מיקרי תבשיל לכן צריך שיהא מעט בשר סריך עליו





            share|improve this answer















            The Darkei Moshe (Rema) Orach CHaim 475,10 gives the final verdict:




            כתב מהרי"ו בדרשותיו שצריך לצלות הזרוע והביצה מבע"י דהואיל שאינו אוכלו בי"ט אסור לצלותו בי"ט ונראה דאם רוצה לאכלו בי"ט ראשון ולעשות אחרות לליל י"ט שני דרשות בידו ואז יוכל לצלות אף בי"ט הואיל שאכלו באותו יום ולא כתב מהרי"ו אלא לפי המנהג שנוהגים להשהותו עד ליל ב':

            The Mahariv says one should roast the meat on the bone and the egg during the day before Yom Tov since one does not eat the meat on the bone rather he keeps them till the second night of Seder to use again (it is forbidden to cook from one day of Yomtov for the sake of the next day unless its Shabbos where one requires an Eruv Tavshilin).

            But it seems that as long as one intends to eat the meat of the bone or the egg during that Yom tov day's meal (As the meat which is roasted one should avoid eating on seder night as noted Shulchan Aruch 476,2) one can roast the bone with its meat on Seder night as one will eat it on the same day as it was cooked. One can then roast another bone with meat on the second night of seder for usage during Seder as one of the two cooked foods as long as he eats it the next day for the second Yom tov day meal. Even the Mahariv would have agreed to this had the minhag in his place not been to keep the same zeroa for both days.




            • So when cooking Zeroa on Pesach night one must eat it the next day and make a new one on second night of seder.

            • But if one cooks the zeroa on the day before Pesach one does not need to eat the bone meat rather keep it for both Seder nights and optionally eat it during the second day meal.

            • Note: The bone should have meat as the Darkei Moshe ibid, 8 says עצם בלא בשר לא מיקרי תבשיל לכן צריך שיהא מעט בשר סריך עליו






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            edited yesterday

























            answered 2 days ago









            user15464user15464

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            5,9751071





















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                Mishna Berura 473.4 sk 32




                (לב) וכן נוהגין בעירנו - לצלות הביצה. ואסור לאכול הזרוע בלילה דאין אוכלין צלי בלילה אבל הביצה אף שהיא צלויה מותר שאין איסור צלי בביצה ולפ"ז אסור לצלות הזרוע בלילה אלא מבעו"י אם לא שדעתו לאכלו למחר באותו היום וע"כ אם שכח וצלאו בלילה יזהר לאכלו מחר בבקר כ"כ המ"א ושארי אחרונים ואם דעתו שלא לאכול הביצה עד ליל ב' גם הביצה אסור לצלותה בלילה אלא מבעוד יום. כתב בח"א רע עלי המעשה שזורקין הזרוע והוא ביזוי מצוה. ומצוה להניח ביו"ט שני בבקר לתוך הצלי שצולין ליו"ט ואוכלין אותו:




                At the end of the sk he quotes Chaye Adam who feels with the fact that some persons throw the zroa in the Bin. This is disrespectful for the mitsva to put it at the second day of pesach with the meat they grill for Yom Tov. This explanation has nothing to do when the zroa was grilled.






                share|improve this answer



























                  2














                  Mishna Berura 473.4 sk 32




                  (לב) וכן נוהגין בעירנו - לצלות הביצה. ואסור לאכול הזרוע בלילה דאין אוכלין צלי בלילה אבל הביצה אף שהיא צלויה מותר שאין איסור צלי בביצה ולפ"ז אסור לצלות הזרוע בלילה אלא מבעו"י אם לא שדעתו לאכלו למחר באותו היום וע"כ אם שכח וצלאו בלילה יזהר לאכלו מחר בבקר כ"כ המ"א ושארי אחרונים ואם דעתו שלא לאכול הביצה עד ליל ב' גם הביצה אסור לצלותה בלילה אלא מבעוד יום. כתב בח"א רע עלי המעשה שזורקין הזרוע והוא ביזוי מצוה. ומצוה להניח ביו"ט שני בבקר לתוך הצלי שצולין ליו"ט ואוכלין אותו:




                  At the end of the sk he quotes Chaye Adam who feels with the fact that some persons throw the zroa in the Bin. This is disrespectful for the mitsva to put it at the second day of pesach with the meat they grill for Yom Tov. This explanation has nothing to do when the zroa was grilled.






                  share|improve this answer

























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                    2








                    2







                    Mishna Berura 473.4 sk 32




                    (לב) וכן נוהגין בעירנו - לצלות הביצה. ואסור לאכול הזרוע בלילה דאין אוכלין צלי בלילה אבל הביצה אף שהיא צלויה מותר שאין איסור צלי בביצה ולפ"ז אסור לצלות הזרוע בלילה אלא מבעו"י אם לא שדעתו לאכלו למחר באותו היום וע"כ אם שכח וצלאו בלילה יזהר לאכלו מחר בבקר כ"כ המ"א ושארי אחרונים ואם דעתו שלא לאכול הביצה עד ליל ב' גם הביצה אסור לצלותה בלילה אלא מבעוד יום. כתב בח"א רע עלי המעשה שזורקין הזרוע והוא ביזוי מצוה. ומצוה להניח ביו"ט שני בבקר לתוך הצלי שצולין ליו"ט ואוכלין אותו:




                    At the end of the sk he quotes Chaye Adam who feels with the fact that some persons throw the zroa in the Bin. This is disrespectful for the mitsva to put it at the second day of pesach with the meat they grill for Yom Tov. This explanation has nothing to do when the zroa was grilled.






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                    Mishna Berura 473.4 sk 32




                    (לב) וכן נוהגין בעירנו - לצלות הביצה. ואסור לאכול הזרוע בלילה דאין אוכלין צלי בלילה אבל הביצה אף שהיא צלויה מותר שאין איסור צלי בביצה ולפ"ז אסור לצלות הזרוע בלילה אלא מבעו"י אם לא שדעתו לאכלו למחר באותו היום וע"כ אם שכח וצלאו בלילה יזהר לאכלו מחר בבקר כ"כ המ"א ושארי אחרונים ואם דעתו שלא לאכול הביצה עד ליל ב' גם הביצה אסור לצלותה בלילה אלא מבעוד יום. כתב בח"א רע עלי המעשה שזורקין הזרוע והוא ביזוי מצוה. ומצוה להניח ביו"ט שני בבקר לתוך הצלי שצולין ליו"ט ואוכלין אותו:




                    At the end of the sk he quotes Chaye Adam who feels with the fact that some persons throw the zroa in the Bin. This is disrespectful for the mitsva to put it at the second day of pesach with the meat they grill for Yom Tov. This explanation has nothing to do when the zroa was grilled.







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                    share|improve this answer










                    answered 2 days ago









                    koutykouty

                    15.8k32047




                    15.8k32047





















                        1














                        Ben Ish Chay (Tzav 30) says not to eat it the first night or day of Pesach, but that you can roast it on Pesach anyway if you forgot to do so before Pesach. He implies that his responsum collection Mikavtziel may explain why, but I don't have a copy or see one online.






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                          1














                          Ben Ish Chay (Tzav 30) says not to eat it the first night or day of Pesach, but that you can roast it on Pesach anyway if you forgot to do so before Pesach. He implies that his responsum collection Mikavtziel may explain why, but I don't have a copy or see one online.






                          share|improve this answer

























                            1












                            1








                            1







                            Ben Ish Chay (Tzav 30) says not to eat it the first night or day of Pesach, but that you can roast it on Pesach anyway if you forgot to do so before Pesach. He implies that his responsum collection Mikavtziel may explain why, but I don't have a copy or see one online.






                            share|improve this answer













                            Ben Ish Chay (Tzav 30) says not to eat it the first night or day of Pesach, but that you can roast it on Pesach anyway if you forgot to do so before Pesach. He implies that his responsum collection Mikavtziel may explain why, but I don't have a copy or see one online.







                            share|improve this answer












                            share|improve this answer



                            share|improve this answer










                            answered 2 days ago









                            msh210msh210

                            48.5k1191290




                            48.5k1191290













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