Compactness of finite setsProof: if $Ksubset M$ is compact and $Asubset K$ is closed, then $A$ is compactCan open sets be an open cover, for itself?Continuity and Compactnessbaby rudin 2.33, relative compactnessProperty of compact subsetsIssue with compactness implies boundedness proofHow is $K subset G_alpha_1 cup cdots cup G_alpha_n $, where $G_alpha$'s are the open subsets of X corresponding to open subsets of $Y$?Intersection of compact subsets of metric space / seeking alternative proofDon't understand well the definition of compactness, or a compact setQuestion on Every k-cell is compact (Rudin Thm 2.40)
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Compactness of finite sets
Proof: if $Ksubset M$ is compact and $Asubset K$ is closed, then $A$ is compactCan open sets be an open cover, for itself?Continuity and Compactnessbaby rudin 2.33, relative compactnessProperty of compact subsetsIssue with compactness implies boundedness proofHow is $K subset G_alpha_1 cup cdots cup G_alpha_n $, where $G_alpha$'s are the open subsets of X corresponding to open subsets of $Y$?Intersection of compact subsets of metric space / seeking alternative proofDon't understand well the definition of compactness, or a compact setQuestion on Every k-cell is compact (Rudin Thm 2.40)
$begingroup$
In rudin's analysis books, he defines compactness as: A subset $K$ of a metric space $X$ is $bf compact$ if every open cover of $K$ contains a finite subcover. More explicitly is that if $ G_alpha $ is an open cover of $K$ then one can select finitely many indices so that $K$ is contained in $G_alpha_1 cup ... cup G_alpha_n $
Rudin claims that a finite set is compact as an obvious fact. Im trying to verify this fact myself:
verification:
Let $F$ be a finite set and write it as $ a_1,...,a_n $ Take any open cover $ G_alpha $ of $F$. We can consider the open balls centered at $a_i$ and let $B_i$ be such ball. Then, $B_1 cup ... cup B_n$ contains $F$. Now, this seems incomplete as we must show that this finite union of open balls is in $cup_alpha G_alpha$. How do we check this?
real-analysis
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
In rudin's analysis books, he defines compactness as: A subset $K$ of a metric space $X$ is $bf compact$ if every open cover of $K$ contains a finite subcover. More explicitly is that if $ G_alpha $ is an open cover of $K$ then one can select finitely many indices so that $K$ is contained in $G_alpha_1 cup ... cup G_alpha_n $
Rudin claims that a finite set is compact as an obvious fact. Im trying to verify this fact myself:
verification:
Let $F$ be a finite set and write it as $ a_1,...,a_n $ Take any open cover $ G_alpha $ of $F$. We can consider the open balls centered at $a_i$ and let $B_i$ be such ball. Then, $B_1 cup ... cup B_n$ contains $F$. Now, this seems incomplete as we must show that this finite union of open balls is in $cup_alpha G_alpha$. How do we check this?
real-analysis
$endgroup$
2
$begingroup$
Your reasoning is flawed; there is no reason to consider these open balls. Instead, you need to take your cover $G_alpha$ and show that you only need finitely many of them to cover the set. In this case, if $F$ is finite and $F subset cup G_alpha$, then each member of $F$ is in at least one particular $G_alpha$. Do you see how you only need finitely many of $G_alpha$ then?
$endgroup$
– User8128
May 25 at 6:19
1
$begingroup$
No; you can’t use open balls. You need to find a finite set of elements of the given cover that already covers $F$. You know that $Fsubseteq cup G_alpha$. That means, for example, that $a_1incup G_alpha$. That means that there exists an $alpha_1$ such that $a_1in G_alpha_1$...
$endgroup$
– Arturo Magidin
May 25 at 6:20
add a comment |
$begingroup$
In rudin's analysis books, he defines compactness as: A subset $K$ of a metric space $X$ is $bf compact$ if every open cover of $K$ contains a finite subcover. More explicitly is that if $ G_alpha $ is an open cover of $K$ then one can select finitely many indices so that $K$ is contained in $G_alpha_1 cup ... cup G_alpha_n $
Rudin claims that a finite set is compact as an obvious fact. Im trying to verify this fact myself:
verification:
Let $F$ be a finite set and write it as $ a_1,...,a_n $ Take any open cover $ G_alpha $ of $F$. We can consider the open balls centered at $a_i$ and let $B_i$ be such ball. Then, $B_1 cup ... cup B_n$ contains $F$. Now, this seems incomplete as we must show that this finite union of open balls is in $cup_alpha G_alpha$. How do we check this?
real-analysis
$endgroup$
In rudin's analysis books, he defines compactness as: A subset $K$ of a metric space $X$ is $bf compact$ if every open cover of $K$ contains a finite subcover. More explicitly is that if $ G_alpha $ is an open cover of $K$ then one can select finitely many indices so that $K$ is contained in $G_alpha_1 cup ... cup G_alpha_n $
Rudin claims that a finite set is compact as an obvious fact. Im trying to verify this fact myself:
verification:
Let $F$ be a finite set and write it as $ a_1,...,a_n $ Take any open cover $ G_alpha $ of $F$. We can consider the open balls centered at $a_i$ and let $B_i$ be such ball. Then, $B_1 cup ... cup B_n$ contains $F$. Now, this seems incomplete as we must show that this finite union of open balls is in $cup_alpha G_alpha$. How do we check this?
real-analysis
real-analysis
asked May 25 at 6:10
ILoveMathILoveMath
5,22032574
5,22032574
2
$begingroup$
Your reasoning is flawed; there is no reason to consider these open balls. Instead, you need to take your cover $G_alpha$ and show that you only need finitely many of them to cover the set. In this case, if $F$ is finite and $F subset cup G_alpha$, then each member of $F$ is in at least one particular $G_alpha$. Do you see how you only need finitely many of $G_alpha$ then?
$endgroup$
– User8128
May 25 at 6:19
1
$begingroup$
No; you can’t use open balls. You need to find a finite set of elements of the given cover that already covers $F$. You know that $Fsubseteq cup G_alpha$. That means, for example, that $a_1incup G_alpha$. That means that there exists an $alpha_1$ such that $a_1in G_alpha_1$...
$endgroup$
– Arturo Magidin
May 25 at 6:20
add a comment |
2
$begingroup$
Your reasoning is flawed; there is no reason to consider these open balls. Instead, you need to take your cover $G_alpha$ and show that you only need finitely many of them to cover the set. In this case, if $F$ is finite and $F subset cup G_alpha$, then each member of $F$ is in at least one particular $G_alpha$. Do you see how you only need finitely many of $G_alpha$ then?
$endgroup$
– User8128
May 25 at 6:19
1
$begingroup$
No; you can’t use open balls. You need to find a finite set of elements of the given cover that already covers $F$. You know that $Fsubseteq cup G_alpha$. That means, for example, that $a_1incup G_alpha$. That means that there exists an $alpha_1$ such that $a_1in G_alpha_1$...
$endgroup$
– Arturo Magidin
May 25 at 6:20
2
2
$begingroup$
Your reasoning is flawed; there is no reason to consider these open balls. Instead, you need to take your cover $G_alpha$ and show that you only need finitely many of them to cover the set. In this case, if $F$ is finite and $F subset cup G_alpha$, then each member of $F$ is in at least one particular $G_alpha$. Do you see how you only need finitely many of $G_alpha$ then?
$endgroup$
– User8128
May 25 at 6:19
$begingroup$
Your reasoning is flawed; there is no reason to consider these open balls. Instead, you need to take your cover $G_alpha$ and show that you only need finitely many of them to cover the set. In this case, if $F$ is finite and $F subset cup G_alpha$, then each member of $F$ is in at least one particular $G_alpha$. Do you see how you only need finitely many of $G_alpha$ then?
$endgroup$
– User8128
May 25 at 6:19
1
1
$begingroup$
No; you can’t use open balls. You need to find a finite set of elements of the given cover that already covers $F$. You know that $Fsubseteq cup G_alpha$. That means, for example, that $a_1incup G_alpha$. That means that there exists an $alpha_1$ such that $a_1in G_alpha_1$...
$endgroup$
– Arturo Magidin
May 25 at 6:20
$begingroup$
No; you can’t use open balls. You need to find a finite set of elements of the given cover that already covers $F$. You know that $Fsubseteq cup G_alpha$. That means, for example, that $a_1incup G_alpha$. That means that there exists an $alpha_1$ such that $a_1in G_alpha_1$...
$endgroup$
– Arturo Magidin
May 25 at 6:20
add a comment |
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
There's no guarantee that any of the $B_i$ are in the set $G_alpha$. For instance, We could have $G_alpha = F$.
The point of compactness is that you really find a subcover of any given cover. In this case, we can argue as follows: suppose we are given a cover $G_alpha$ of $F = a_1, ldots, a_n $. For all $i$, pick some $G_alpha_i$ which contains $a_i$ (we know such a set exists because $G_alpha$ covers $F$). Then $G_alpha_1,ldots,G_alpha_n$ is a finite subcover.
Notice how compactness really is a consequence of the finiteness of $F$, i.e. a property of $F$, and we aren't using any properties of the cover, since we don't know what it looks like a priori.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
There is an open set that covers $a_1$
There is an open set that covers $a_2$
There is an open set that covers $a_3$
There is an open set that covers $a_4$
There is an open set that covers $a_5$
There is an open set that covers $a_6$
There is an open set that covers $a_7$
There is an open set that covers $a_8$
There is an open set that covers $a_9$
There is an open set that covers $a_10$
There is an open set that covers $a_11$
There is an open set that covers $a_12$
There is an open set that covers $a_13$
There is an open set that covers $a_14$
There is an open set that covers $a_15$
There is an open set that covers $a_16$
There is an open set that covers $a_17$
There is an open set that covers $a_18$
There is an open set that covers $a_19$
There is an open set that covers $a_20$
There is an open set that covers $a_21$
...
...
...
There is an open set that covers $a_n$
It's a long but finite list, so it's a finite subcover.
$endgroup$
4
$begingroup$
This should get a funniest answer price :D
$endgroup$
– Maximilian Janisch
May 25 at 6:58
15
$begingroup$
Hmm... I am not sure to understand how you cover $a_22$...
$endgroup$
– J.-E. Pin
May 25 at 7:35
add a comment |
Your Answer
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2 Answers
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2 Answers
2
active
oldest
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oldest
votes
$begingroup$
There's no guarantee that any of the $B_i$ are in the set $G_alpha$. For instance, We could have $G_alpha = F$.
The point of compactness is that you really find a subcover of any given cover. In this case, we can argue as follows: suppose we are given a cover $G_alpha$ of $F = a_1, ldots, a_n $. For all $i$, pick some $G_alpha_i$ which contains $a_i$ (we know such a set exists because $G_alpha$ covers $F$). Then $G_alpha_1,ldots,G_alpha_n$ is a finite subcover.
Notice how compactness really is a consequence of the finiteness of $F$, i.e. a property of $F$, and we aren't using any properties of the cover, since we don't know what it looks like a priori.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
There's no guarantee that any of the $B_i$ are in the set $G_alpha$. For instance, We could have $G_alpha = F$.
The point of compactness is that you really find a subcover of any given cover. In this case, we can argue as follows: suppose we are given a cover $G_alpha$ of $F = a_1, ldots, a_n $. For all $i$, pick some $G_alpha_i$ which contains $a_i$ (we know such a set exists because $G_alpha$ covers $F$). Then $G_alpha_1,ldots,G_alpha_n$ is a finite subcover.
Notice how compactness really is a consequence of the finiteness of $F$, i.e. a property of $F$, and we aren't using any properties of the cover, since we don't know what it looks like a priori.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
There's no guarantee that any of the $B_i$ are in the set $G_alpha$. For instance, We could have $G_alpha = F$.
The point of compactness is that you really find a subcover of any given cover. In this case, we can argue as follows: suppose we are given a cover $G_alpha$ of $F = a_1, ldots, a_n $. For all $i$, pick some $G_alpha_i$ which contains $a_i$ (we know such a set exists because $G_alpha$ covers $F$). Then $G_alpha_1,ldots,G_alpha_n$ is a finite subcover.
Notice how compactness really is a consequence of the finiteness of $F$, i.e. a property of $F$, and we aren't using any properties of the cover, since we don't know what it looks like a priori.
$endgroup$
There's no guarantee that any of the $B_i$ are in the set $G_alpha$. For instance, We could have $G_alpha = F$.
The point of compactness is that you really find a subcover of any given cover. In this case, we can argue as follows: suppose we are given a cover $G_alpha$ of $F = a_1, ldots, a_n $. For all $i$, pick some $G_alpha_i$ which contains $a_i$ (we know such a set exists because $G_alpha$ covers $F$). Then $G_alpha_1,ldots,G_alpha_n$ is a finite subcover.
Notice how compactness really is a consequence of the finiteness of $F$, i.e. a property of $F$, and we aren't using any properties of the cover, since we don't know what it looks like a priori.
answered May 25 at 6:21
useruser
486312
486312
add a comment |
add a comment |
$begingroup$
There is an open set that covers $a_1$
There is an open set that covers $a_2$
There is an open set that covers $a_3$
There is an open set that covers $a_4$
There is an open set that covers $a_5$
There is an open set that covers $a_6$
There is an open set that covers $a_7$
There is an open set that covers $a_8$
There is an open set that covers $a_9$
There is an open set that covers $a_10$
There is an open set that covers $a_11$
There is an open set that covers $a_12$
There is an open set that covers $a_13$
There is an open set that covers $a_14$
There is an open set that covers $a_15$
There is an open set that covers $a_16$
There is an open set that covers $a_17$
There is an open set that covers $a_18$
There is an open set that covers $a_19$
There is an open set that covers $a_20$
There is an open set that covers $a_21$
...
...
...
There is an open set that covers $a_n$
It's a long but finite list, so it's a finite subcover.
$endgroup$
4
$begingroup$
This should get a funniest answer price :D
$endgroup$
– Maximilian Janisch
May 25 at 6:58
15
$begingroup$
Hmm... I am not sure to understand how you cover $a_22$...
$endgroup$
– J.-E. Pin
May 25 at 7:35
add a comment |
$begingroup$
There is an open set that covers $a_1$
There is an open set that covers $a_2$
There is an open set that covers $a_3$
There is an open set that covers $a_4$
There is an open set that covers $a_5$
There is an open set that covers $a_6$
There is an open set that covers $a_7$
There is an open set that covers $a_8$
There is an open set that covers $a_9$
There is an open set that covers $a_10$
There is an open set that covers $a_11$
There is an open set that covers $a_12$
There is an open set that covers $a_13$
There is an open set that covers $a_14$
There is an open set that covers $a_15$
There is an open set that covers $a_16$
There is an open set that covers $a_17$
There is an open set that covers $a_18$
There is an open set that covers $a_19$
There is an open set that covers $a_20$
There is an open set that covers $a_21$
...
...
...
There is an open set that covers $a_n$
It's a long but finite list, so it's a finite subcover.
$endgroup$
4
$begingroup$
This should get a funniest answer price :D
$endgroup$
– Maximilian Janisch
May 25 at 6:58
15
$begingroup$
Hmm... I am not sure to understand how you cover $a_22$...
$endgroup$
– J.-E. Pin
May 25 at 7:35
add a comment |
$begingroup$
There is an open set that covers $a_1$
There is an open set that covers $a_2$
There is an open set that covers $a_3$
There is an open set that covers $a_4$
There is an open set that covers $a_5$
There is an open set that covers $a_6$
There is an open set that covers $a_7$
There is an open set that covers $a_8$
There is an open set that covers $a_9$
There is an open set that covers $a_10$
There is an open set that covers $a_11$
There is an open set that covers $a_12$
There is an open set that covers $a_13$
There is an open set that covers $a_14$
There is an open set that covers $a_15$
There is an open set that covers $a_16$
There is an open set that covers $a_17$
There is an open set that covers $a_18$
There is an open set that covers $a_19$
There is an open set that covers $a_20$
There is an open set that covers $a_21$
...
...
...
There is an open set that covers $a_n$
It's a long but finite list, so it's a finite subcover.
$endgroup$
There is an open set that covers $a_1$
There is an open set that covers $a_2$
There is an open set that covers $a_3$
There is an open set that covers $a_4$
There is an open set that covers $a_5$
There is an open set that covers $a_6$
There is an open set that covers $a_7$
There is an open set that covers $a_8$
There is an open set that covers $a_9$
There is an open set that covers $a_10$
There is an open set that covers $a_11$
There is an open set that covers $a_12$
There is an open set that covers $a_13$
There is an open set that covers $a_14$
There is an open set that covers $a_15$
There is an open set that covers $a_16$
There is an open set that covers $a_17$
There is an open set that covers $a_18$
There is an open set that covers $a_19$
There is an open set that covers $a_20$
There is an open set that covers $a_21$
...
...
...
There is an open set that covers $a_n$
It's a long but finite list, so it's a finite subcover.
answered May 25 at 6:22
gammagamma
3,63521343
3,63521343
4
$begingroup$
This should get a funniest answer price :D
$endgroup$
– Maximilian Janisch
May 25 at 6:58
15
$begingroup$
Hmm... I am not sure to understand how you cover $a_22$...
$endgroup$
– J.-E. Pin
May 25 at 7:35
add a comment |
4
$begingroup$
This should get a funniest answer price :D
$endgroup$
– Maximilian Janisch
May 25 at 6:58
15
$begingroup$
Hmm... I am not sure to understand how you cover $a_22$...
$endgroup$
– J.-E. Pin
May 25 at 7:35
4
4
$begingroup$
This should get a funniest answer price :D
$endgroup$
– Maximilian Janisch
May 25 at 6:58
$begingroup$
This should get a funniest answer price :D
$endgroup$
– Maximilian Janisch
May 25 at 6:58
15
15
$begingroup$
Hmm... I am not sure to understand how you cover $a_22$...
$endgroup$
– J.-E. Pin
May 25 at 7:35
$begingroup$
Hmm... I am not sure to understand how you cover $a_22$...
$endgroup$
– J.-E. Pin
May 25 at 7:35
add a comment |
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Your reasoning is flawed; there is no reason to consider these open balls. Instead, you need to take your cover $G_alpha$ and show that you only need finitely many of them to cover the set. In this case, if $F$ is finite and $F subset cup G_alpha$, then each member of $F$ is in at least one particular $G_alpha$. Do you see how you only need finitely many of $G_alpha$ then?
$endgroup$
– User8128
May 25 at 6:19
1
$begingroup$
No; you can’t use open balls. You need to find a finite set of elements of the given cover that already covers $F$. You know that $Fsubseteq cup G_alpha$. That means, for example, that $a_1incup G_alpha$. That means that there exists an $alpha_1$ such that $a_1in G_alpha_1$...
$endgroup$
– Arturo Magidin
May 25 at 6:20